Seeking history of Ju88A-5 W.Nr. 6145 with Stab III./KG51

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

Who can help me identify this a/c and its ultimate fate?

This is from a photo of Ju88A-5 9K+CD W.Nr. 6145 of Stab III./KG51, circa the fall of 1940.

Regards,

[G.R.Morrison]

Ju 88A-5 WNr.6145 of 9./KG 51, 9K+KT (Stammkenzeichen: CF+VO)

Reported lost 28.June 1941, cause unknown, Ort unbekannt. Crew (Ff Fw. Gerhard Franke, Bo Uffz. Friedrich Hacke, Bf Uffz. Wilhelm Schröter & Bs Uffz. Wilhelm Niederbaumer) returned. Lfl.4/Eins.Osten

Gen.Qu.6.Abt. Vol.5, 100% loss.

Constructor: ATG Flzg.Werke Leipzig in Aug. 1940.

Hope this helps, GRM

[Larry Hickey]

GRM,

Thanks, this does help.

Obviously this a/c was transferred from the Stab of III./KG51 sometime after the fall of 1940. It appears to have originally carried the code 9K+BD, but the "B" was crudely overpainted with a "C" when the black night finish was applied to the undersides for The Blitz. There are about 10 photos of this plane in the ECPA Collection in Paris.

Regards,

[Chris Goss]

According to the KTB of III/KG 51, CD Wk Nr 2167 was flown by Oblt Küchle on 12 Aug 40 whilst Oblt Schwegler flew BD. Probably A-1s as opposed to A-5s?

[Larry Hickey]

Chris,

The photos clearly show WNr.6145 as an A-5, at least it has the longer wings of the A-5 subtype. I believe that this SN sequence was manufactured in August, 1940, so it has to be sometime after that date. The problem here is that I believe that some A-1s were upgraded to the longer wings of the A-5, which can throw everything off when using manufacturer's data for subtypes.

Do you have the KTB for III./KG51? What period does this cover? For bomber unit KTBs were still working back in the PC for acquisition and translations.

Regards,

Larry

[Jim P.]

Looking at the reported subtypes in the losses from the Ju 88 block WNr. 6100 thru WNr. 6165, they appear to be a mixed bag of A-1s and A-5s. The later the loss the more likely an A-5. There are a few A-5s from late-40. From 43 onwards they appear as A-7s & 12s. Not sure that helps much. Art Medcalf or Ed North could supply a more definitive answer I'm sure.

[ianatheling]

According to http://www.stammkennzeichen.de/ WNr.6145 was a Ju 88A-5, stkz CF+VO.

Ian

[Chris Goss]

Larry: Irritatingly, the then KG 51 Association only gave me the pages referring to 12 Aug 40 and all attempt since then to get more have failed. Quite detailed with codes takes off and landings and full crew so before you ask, leadership on this date was:

Aufklschwarm: Marienfeld in 9K+ED
7 Staffel: Poetter (F) in 9K+AR
8 Staffel: von Schenk (B) in 9K+ES (F was Lt Willy Teichmann)
9 Staffel: Brandt in 9K+BT (his crew was Fw Müller, Fw Herrmann,
Flg Rottbacher)

[ArtieBob]

Based on the numeric production records, W.Nr. 6145 was probably produced in Late September or early October 1940. Remember, completion was not always in numeric sequence. I have the Monatsmeldung for September and during that month there were a total of 149 Ju 88 bombers accepted, of these 99 were A-1s and 50 were A-5s, so this period was right in the middle of the transition from A-1 to A-5 and I have no detailed information (i.e., individual aircraft) how the new wings were allocated to production. Even if an Ju 88 aeroplane came off the line as an A-1, it would quickly be modified to become an A-5 most of the time. So if there is a photo showing it has a long wing and the record says its an A-5, I would believe it. I don't have enough information to determine what it was when first assembled.

Best regards,

Artie Bob

[edNorth]

Hello all.

Not been watching much them last few weeks.. But NDD / HWO are one of my favourite Ju 88 research aspects, so ... I more am on the lines (088)6145 was original Ju 88 A-1, from NDD/HWO components made in May to June 1940, BA acceptance about late July or in August 1940, delivered from Heinkel assembly. Then upgraded in autumn. Specific assignments or precise dates of these a/c are rather hard to find, but some info is at hand on planes very near in the nummerical sequences, and my answer is based on these findings.

regards
ed