List of known Ar 234 Stammkennzeichen and Werknummern?

[richdlc]

Gentlemen - does such a thing exist? Trying to research some KG 76 Arados (F1+AP, F1+DP, F1+GP, F1+PP) but generally interested in all....

I'm also interested in a particular individual in KG 76, Oberfeldwebel Helmut Luther, mentioned in our 'Blitz Bombers' book, any further info on his earlier flying career, or a photo, service record etc

my thanks!
Rich

[Karoband]

Hi Rich,

Smith & Creek, Arado Ar 234 Blitz: The World's First Jet Bomber, (Classic, 2022), pp. 305-312 lists all known werknummern and, where known, their callsigns and unit codes.

Regarding your interest in specific aircraft of 6./KG 76:

On page 289 of Jan Horn's KG 76: Die Chronik des Kampfgeschwaders 76 im Zeitraum 01.01.1944 bis 08.05.1946, (2019), Luther was flying "F1+DP (Werk-Nr. 140476?)" on 15 April 1945. As far as I Know, W.Nr. 140476 was a recce B-2b of 1.(F)/33 with the unit code 8H+DH which was captured intact at Grove-Karup, Denmark on 6 May 1945.

Horn, on page 205, has Luther delivering F1+GP Werk-Nr. 140313 from Alt-Lonnewitz to Munster-Handorf on 13 January 1945 where it was recoded as F1+KT.

As for Luther, Horn has fifteen entries for him including the exact times for his flights. This suggests that Luther's flugbuch survived. Perhaps a member of this community has a copy?

Best regards,

Jim

[richdlc]

This is excellent Jim, thank you!

[richdlc]

just revisiting this guys....

I'm a little confused - the codes listed by Luther in his Flugbuch are F1+AP, F1+DP, F1+GP, F1+PP
Horn also gives F1+DP as the code carried by the Ar 234 that Luther was flying when shot down on 15 April 1945

I am assuming in all cases that these codes are Stammkennzeichen and not Verbandskennzeichen?

[Karoband]

Hi Rich, (I am being restricted to 5 lines to reply!)

The short answer is no, these are unit codes or Verbandskennzeichen that could be changed if the aircraft was transferred to another unit. The "F1" was KG 76's identifying letters and the "P" indicated the 6th staffel.

[richdlc]

thanks Jim
well that's thrown up more questions...
is it possible to match up werknummern with these four aircraft? Why are they not mentioned in the appendices of the Smith/Creek list of known Ar 234 call signs/werknummern/unit codes in the book published as recently as 2022?
You did hint that F1+DP was WNr. 140476 captured by the British at Grove (as does Jan Horn), but how can that be when Luther's FLugbch has it as 95% destroyed?? (Horn says 60% but still, how could the Germans have possibly repaired it? It crashed in flames after the attack by No.56 Sqn Tempests).

Confusing.....

[Chris Goss]

Could be a replacement for F1+DP lost 15 Apr 45. Don’t forget Wk Nrs were unique while codes were not and with the war about to end in 3 weeks, record keeping was the last thing on the Luftwaffe’s mind.

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by richdlc

You did hint that F1+DP was WNr. 140476 captured by the British at Grove (as does Jan Horn), but how can that be when Luther's FLugbch has it as 95% destroyed?? (Horn says 60% but still, how could the Germans have possibly repaired it? It crashed in flames after the attack by No.56 Sqn Tempests).

Confusing.....

It gets better.

On 14 March 1945, 1.(F)/100 reported its strength, deciphered in ULTRA CX/MSS/R492(C),14. This included:

T5+AH, W.Nr. 140149 (the same W.Nr. reported for 4U+DH of 1.(F)/123, shot down 11 February)

T5+CH, W.Nr. 140(digit missing)76 (so 140176, if 140476 was elsewhere?)

[AndyMa]

I think the 4U+DH of 1.(F)/123 shot down 11 February was WNr.140459

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by AndyMa

I think the 4U+DH of 1.(F)/123 shot down 11 February was WNr.140459

Conversely, CX/MSS/R509(A)/17:

No. 20320 from GEDNA ((Lfl. Reich))/((Chief QM)) Engineer 3 to ((Chief QM))/Chief Engineer 3, on 30/3 [1945]:
Following for information:
There have been installed in a/c 8/234 W.Nr. 140317 to 140459 by firm Arado, owing to lack of height-compensating AS 1 FL 22241, AS 1 FL 22234. These equipments will now be exchanged against height-compensating AS 1 FL 22241. Indents for the equipment will be made to firm Arado a/c Works Abt. Altimeters, Technical Branch, Potsdam.

And (from my website):

NOTE: Felde’s Arado was 4U+DH and its Werk Nummer is generally given as 140149 (possibly an error since 1.(F)/100 attributed the same number to its T5+AH a month later). To confuse matters further, Quartermaster General listed the loss of W.Nr. 140459 on 10 February, linking this to Felde’s loss, supposedly the same day. Whether 140459 was also lost is unclear although it was mentioned in a signal on 3 March about a batch of Ar 234s with a non-standard altimeter installed.