Gefr. Helmut Ziehm 9./JG51

[James Farrimond]

Good evening gentleman

Can anyone assist me with an AI1k report for Gefr. Helmut Ziehm of 9./JG51 who crashed his BF109 in the Thames Estuary near Clacton on 11th November 1940 during an attack on convoy FN.332?

Apparently the RAF were responsible but this conflicts with the War Cabinet weekly resume which gives credit to H.M.S. Vimiera (2x Ju87's), H.M.S. Viven (destroyed one and possibly brought down a second Junker)., H.M.S. Londonderry (a Junkers), and H.M. Tug St. Mellons (a Messerschmitt).

Cheers

James

[sidney]

This is an excerpt from the AI1g report dated 13 November 1940.

"Me.109. Crashed on 11.11.40. near Peasmarah, Kent. Map reference:R.3244
No markings to be found. Following fighter action, pilot baled out and aircraft dived vertically into soft ground on the banks of a river and is almost completely buried. Ho traces of bullet strikes to be seen in the small pieces of wreckage still above ground. Pilot prisoner. No further details possible..."

Nigel Parker identified this loss as Bf 109 E-8, 12+I, WNr.4888, piloted by Oblt. Josef Volk of 9./JG 53.

The above does not match your details. I tried also some later date reports, without success thus far.

[Chris Goss]

There were so many claims on 11 Nov 40 to match who got down who over the Estuary is not possible. I think you will find the RAF identified Volk's crash in 1940 backed up by Peter Cornwell at least 35 years ago so I would not give the credit to Nigel per se!

[sidney]

No credit was given to Nigel Parker - his work was quoted as a reference, primarily because the original source of information, that is the RAF, corroborated somewhat later by Peter Cornwell, was unknown to me.

There is no AI1g (i.e. technical report) on this aircraft because it crashed in the Thames estuary. The AI1k (i.e., personnel report) I do not have.

Prien, Stemmer and others in JFV 4/II describe the loss as: 11.11.1940; Gefr. Helmut Ziehm; 9./JG51; aerial combat; crashed in the Thames estuary; FSA; 100%; Bf 109 E.

[Peter Cornwell]

My understanding is that ZIEHM baled out over the Thames Estuary on 11 November 1940 and was rescued by the Seenotdienst - hence no A.I.1 (g) nor (k) Reports exist.

[Chris Goss]

Peter is right-Ziehm baled out uninjured whilst Filke of 7 Staffel was killed. Were they escorting the Stab III Fw 58 which was believed shot down by 249 Sqn at 1430 hrs? Don't forget that I Gruppe lost 2 ac as well this day. Volk's loss by the way was far earlier in the day and not connected

[sidney]

Mentioning Volk's loss in this context was my mistake. It was a false premise believing that Ziehm's loss would be described in N. Parker's book, or A.I.1 (g) report of the day. Apologies.

[James Farrimond]

Thanks for clearing this up guys.

Brave move by the Seenotdienst to rescue a downed pilot from the Thames Estuary!