A couple of shields from Leningrad front

[FPSOlkor]

Can we have any info on the incidents?

[David E. Brown]

FPSOlkor,

Just an observation, but in the top photo is that a human tooth and humerus I see? Were there human remains associated with this excavation?

If so, perhaps you might wish to contact the appropriate German authorities (WAsT).

John Manrho would be the one to best comment on this subject given his expertise on determining pilot identites and working with the related institutions. Are you out there John?

Cheers,

David

[FPSOlkor]

This plane fw-190 was found (not by me) near Leningrad. it was completely smashed. Me-110 was also found (not by me)near Leningrad, with crew of 2, one RK. German authorities are really slow - after 2 years they gave no reply. Excavation teams leader has decided to show the shields to public - may be some information will be available.

[FPSOlkor]

No one can help with identification of these aircraft?

[Hans Nauta]

I've sent John a PM with regard to this thread.

Regards,
Hans Nauta

[FPSOlkor]

Thanks m8te!

[John Manrho]

The best way is to contact the WASt (Deutsche Dienststelle) and VDK Kassel (Volksbund). I am sure they will respond to honest and correct reports of finds of human remains. If somebody says they do not respond, than either they were not properly contacted or....

cheers,

John.

[FPSOlkor]

...Or they respond that they are not interested, or don't respond at all. Later I will post a shield from He-111 also found in Leningrad area with at least 4 crew members. A contact with WASt resulted in letter, with which 2 crewmembers were identified, but Germans refuse to collect the remains, and for 2 years they are stored in a morgue. If they will be burried (which is going to happen soon, if not happened yet, as the body storage time expires) by official authorities - most likely there will be no way to find the graves. The excavations are done by official methods only, and no money are needed from Germans (except for coffin transfer expenses), if you wanted to say that we are trying to get money from someone.

[John Manrho]

So, why does it work everywhere but not in Russia? In your opinion it are the German authorities that are doing nothing. I have worked with them for over 20 years and have no complaints at all. We recovered human remains too and solved some 20 MIA cases.

Did you contact the VDK? They must be active in the Leningrad area. Why don't you bury the human remains temporarily at a local graveyard with an official registration by Russian authorities, send the evidence of identification including personal effects to the WAST or the VDK and then start the discussion how to transfer the human remains to a German military cemetery.

More than 500,000 MIA/KIA have been recovered by the VDK in the Eastern Block since 1990, don't you think that is enough proof that the VDK is actively seeking to solve the many MIA cases in Russia, Belarus or the Ukrain?

cheers,

John.

[FPSOlkor]

We tried... At monday the chief of Len.obl. excavartion teams will be back, and i'll ask him about how many remains were found, when, and how many were claimed by Germans (if you want, I can try to connect you). The burial will take place when body storage time defined by the law will expire. The problem is that "numbered" (that is - with no names, only the number of the burrial site) graves tend to disappear in a few years. MO RF does not include these graves into protected burial sites, and Germans do not want to pay for them either, so no one looks for them. As for us - we are not in a position to look after each and every grave - there were just during this year more then 4 000 body remains uncovered, and we have more than enough problems with identifying and burying our soldiers. Speaking about system - in Rusia there are representatives of German authorities that are supposed to work in this area - but they are notorious for not being interested in their work completely. BTW - if you want to help, I may give you the information where, when, in what condition and by whom these planes were found - I just do not really think it should be on public display. Welcome to PM.