Bf 109 G-6 167295 tail piece

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hello,

I recently received an original fabric part of the tail rudder and wing of Bf 109 G-6 WkNr 167295 (see photo).

Does anybody know anything about this 109's history? The part of the wing (according to a handwritten note) shows a red "V". It might have been the first letter of the word "Vorsicht". It is also made out of fabric so it must have been part of the aileron. But I couldn't find any photo that shows such a large "V" on the aileron of a Bf 109.

Is there any 109 expert who can tell more about the "V"?

Thanks,

Roger

[Revi16]

From the looks of it, I have doubts that the fabric is from any Bf-109.

[Roger Gaemperle]

Revi16,

It is from a 109:

- First the GI has written this on the backside of both pieces of fabric, and second
- look at the attached photo of a Bf 109 of the 166xxx series which had a similar style of WkNr on the tail

Roger

[Revi16]

Well, if a G.I. has written on the back of it, it's obviously authentic.

What would happen if a G.I. wrote on the back of this Stearmans fabric thats been sitting in a hangar for 50 years? Authentic?

Then again, I don't have any money invested in it.

[stephen f. polyak]

Revi,

As a collector for more than 15 years, and having owned and examined numerous Luftwaffe airframe/control surface fabric relics, I am very confident that the items shown are authentic.

I base this assessment on the provenance reported for the items (airplane fabric was a common GI souvenir; rear surface personal annotations are typical on these pieces too), the specific details of construction (e.g., pinking cut section edges) and red-painted rear surfaces (primer/sealant).

The missing first digit (a “1”) on the numbered piece corresponds to the portion of the fabric that overlaid the base structure of the rudder’s forward/hinged edge. That structure would have compromised quickly cutting thorough the entire numbered section. Thus, the first digit was “sacrificed”, with no loss in soldier war prize value. Beyond that, we see an equivalent complete example on another Bf 109 with a similar series W.Nr.

Could the red “V” marking on the “wing” piece have been a location reference for placing a control surface lock or possibly a simple visual indicator for the movable surface’s position? I suspect the “wing” fabric could have come from an aileron, elevator, or even another region of the rudder.

I wish Roger success in learning the history of this airplane.

Steve

[Roger Gaemperle]

Revi,

I am fully convinced that it is original and I don't see any reason why it shouldn't. The color fits to late war Bf 109, the fabric is red on the backside, everything (including the black number) smells old (i.e. not like new paint) and the size and looks of the black number fits perfectly to the numbers of similar Bf 109.

In addition Steve gave a very good explanation why the first digit is missing. I doubt that if somebody wanted to fake such an item that he would omit the first digit. I am fully confident that it is an original.

Now, hopefully somebody has some information about this airplane. Since it survived the war it is quite likely that somebody had taken a photo of it before the number was removed.

Steve, thank you for your reply. It could have been a visual indicator for the movable surface's position. If it was a marking for a control surface lock I think it would have been split into two parts (on on e.g. the aileron and one on the wing). The "V" looks like a real letter and might have been part of a word. It could be "Vorsicht".

Perhaps one of the 109 experts have seen something like that on another 109.

Regards
Roger

[Andy Saunders]

I would certainly concur with Roger and Steve. Like them, I have seen a bit of this stuff in my time!!

Are we certain that the portion with the "V" came from the same aeroplane? Could it be from a different aircraft entirely - but has become linked through the long-term association of both items being kept together?

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hi Andy,

Thanks for your message. It says "This is from the wing of a German ME 109" on the backside. It could be that it is from a different 109 than 167295 but I guess it is from a 109 unless he confused the airplane with another type (which I think often happened if I look at some captions of wartime photos that identify e.g. a 190 as 109, etc.).

Regards
Roger

[Andy Saunders]

Hello Roger

It is the "V" that is confusing, although until recently I had a large canvas/fabric cover marked VERSCHLUSSDECKEL in red, very similar style, which I think was some kind of Luftwaffe aircraft engine cover? However, your piece looks like doped fabric of the kind one would find on control surfaces etc so I am really not helping much!

Hope you are enjoying all those data plates!

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hi Andy,

Thanks for the info regarding the "V".

The V is quite large (10cm in height), it must have been something important. I think standard stencils were not that big.

By the way, I have posted better pictures (also of the backside) at swapey

http://www.swapey.com/index.aspx?nav...a-84f04e8bc974

Yes, I really liked you data plates. If you ever get some more, please let me know.

Regards
Roger