Me 110 crash 15/10/40

[paul peters]

Good evening everybody,
In the evening of 15 October 1940 Me 110, Werknummer 3385 of NJG2 crashed north of Fliegerhorst Gilze-Rijen. The pilot was Ernst Schulz (rank unknown), but who was the gunner of the a/c? Both crewmembers bailed out to safety.
Tia,
paul peters

[Joe Potter]

Can you check the Werk Nr, I have 3385, 3M+AH, 4/NJG2 lost on 17.10.40 at Dongen, Pilot Oblt Paul Zimmermann, and Gefr Walter Makowski both killed.

[paul peters]

Hello Joe,
The crash near Dongen was on 17/10/1940. The a/c was Ju88C-2, R4+EL,
Werknummer 0251 of I/NJG2 with the crewmembers you mentioned.
Regards,
paul

[Joe Potter]

Hi Paul,

May I suggest that you take this point up with the authors of the book that I quote from, Zerstörer by John J. Vasco and Peter D. Cornwell, both are members of this board.
Regards
Joe

[ju55dk]

This is what the original german sources say on this subject:

16/17.10.1940 4/NJG 2 Capelle(Holland). Feindflug.
Bf 110D-1 Wnr. 3385 Vkz. 3M+AH.
FlzFüh. Oblt. Paul Zimmermann und Bf. Gfr. Walter Makowski Gefallen.
Absturz 100%

17.10.1940 I/NJG 2 FlP. Gilze-Rijen. Feindflug.
Ju 88C-2 Wnr. 0251.
Besatzung Unverletzt.
Bruchlandung 20%.

Wast Berlin, GQM-Verlustliste BA/MA Freiburg and Balss Nachtjagdverluste! Perhaps Paul Peters would mention his source?

Junker

[paul peters]

Gentlemen,

Could there have been a change of data?
Police report #66 of the police officer at Sprang-Capelle: Aircraft crash at Sprang-Capelle on October 15,1940.
"..... Police officer Keijnemans had found the pilot... He had only minor injuries of the left arm... This pilot was named ERNST SCHULZ, born at Wittenburg, 14 January 1915, stationed at Gilze en Rijen, 4,n.j.g.2. who declared to be the pilot of the crashed aircraft Messerschmidt 110 and he could save himself with his parachute. The pilot declared furthermore that the other crewmember had bailed out about 3 K.M. before....".
In my opinion there can be no doubt regarding date, type of a/c and place.
Another source is "Vijf jaar luchtfront, The airfield Gilze-Rijen during the Second World War". Part II
Regards,
paul

[ju55dk]

I agree with the police-report, but also that it has nothing to do with the above mentioned Bf 110 or Ju 88. What you are looking for is:

15.10.1940 Sprang-Dahlem
4/NJG 2 Bf 110D-3 Wnr. 3812 A2+BL Feindflug.
Besatzung Unverletzt Abgesprungen.
Absturtz 100%.

Source: GQM-Verluste!

Junker

[paul peters]

Junker,
I am looking for the Bordfunker of Ernst Schulz who crashed at Sprang-Capelle. This man was found by the police of Waalwijk, both places within 10 km of my dwelling place! I never heard of Sprang-Dahlem, I only know there is a Dahlem NE of Luik (Liege or Luttich),Belgium.
paul

[ju55dk]

Well German names for places in their loss-reports are at times not very reliable. It is the only loss on this date that can match the policereport. Sadly no names are given as the crew escaped unhurt. Good luck with your namehunt.

Junker

[paul peters]

To Joe Potter and Junker,

It took a couple of days before I found the German Verlustmeldung, but now I have it.
4/NJG2
Dongen, Holland. 17.10.40 zurueck v. Feindflug. Ju 88, W.nr. 0251 R4+EL
Oblt . Paul Zimmermann inflg. Flgz. absturz todl. verungl.
Gefr. Walter Makowski same remark.

Hope these sources will do.
Regards,
paul