Spitfire brought down by Royal Artillery - Normandy.

[cheesey]

Hello all.

I wonder if anyone can throw some light on the following incident ?

A friend and work colleague has provided me with some information passed on to him by his grandfather, Capt.R.E.Roberts (dentist) who was serving in the RAMC during the Normandy campaign. He was attached to 146 Field Ambulance. It relates to an incident he witnessed in which an allied aircraft, possibly a Spitfire, was brought down when it strayed into the path of a Royal Artillery 25pdr barrage ! The account was written on scraps of paper during the 1970s and I reproduce the relevant passage below.

"I remember during that first rest period (it was for several days), we were enjoying the sunshine, and the birds were singing, and one really could have thought that we were 100 miles from war. Suddenly the R.A. set up a barrage of shelling and a lone Spitfire whistling by was caught by one of the shells which removed part of his tail.
Seeing the field and the Red Cross, he tried to do a quick landing, but the height was too little and he crashed and was killed instantly. The most appalling and frightening thing was that, as we watched from the reception tent, the engine of the Spitfire broke loose from its housing and 6ft of solid steel came rolling at speed towards the F.A. station.
Our hair stood on end as we watched it slowly come to a rest no more than a dozen feet from where we were standing. It was a close one (one of many close calls pop had !) and it could have done a lot more damage to the station."

I have no idea of the exact date or location other than it was about the 12th of June (he landed on the 8th and was in the front line for approx 3-4 days without rest) and that it was possibly near to Arromanches.
I have looked at F.C.Losses (Franks) for this period and can find no real matches ! Can anyone please help with a possible aircraft/pilot match or location ?
Thanks in advance, Steve.

[Six Nifty .50s]

Originally Posted by cheesey

Hello all.
I have looked at F.C.Losses (Franks) for this period and can find no real matches ! Can anyone please help with a possible aircraft/pilot match or location ?
Thanks in advance, Steve.

The victim may have been an FAA or USN pilot spotting for offshore naval batteries. According to Mike Crosley of 3 Wing they flew low and were frequently attacked by flak and fighters from their own side. I'm not sure how many Americans flew Seafires during the Normandy invasion, but VCS-7 traded their seaplanes for Spitfires.

[Graham Boak]

Does Franks' book include 2 TAF losses, as these would be more likely than FC aircraft? I can't find a similar case in the recent Shores/Thomas book on the subject, but there are a number of losses put down to Flak - or even Allied Flak. There could have been a misunderstanding as to the cause.

[Brian]

Hi Cheesey, Six-Fifty and Graham

I've just had a look at my friendly fire notes for the period 6-20 June and have a staggering total of 16 Spitfires, 1 RN Seafire, 2 RAF Mustangs, five US P-51s, one P-47 (also 5 Dakotas, 2 Mosquitoes and one B-26) all probably the victims of allied guns/fighters 'over the beaches'!!!!

I haven't had time yet to fully research these incidents, but just to let you have some idea of the extent of friendly fire.

Cheers
Brian

[cheesey]

Thanks chaps.

Frank's book does include 2 TAF losses and there are many losses attributable to 'Flak' both enemy and friendly. I wonder if the RA battery was perhaps an AA battery and not 25pdr ? After the passage of some 30 years Capt.Roberts may have mistaken the batteries function.

He mentions in a previous entry that it seemed that whenever 146 Ambulance set up shop an RA unit would also set up nearby ! The gunners claimed that it was because they wouldn't have very far to cart the wounded should they be hit but I suspect it may have been for a more practical reason.

Considering that the medics would lay out a 40' x 40' Red Cross marker within the field hospital and Capt. Roberts claimed they were never attacked during the course of the war in NW Europe then maybe this was the safest place to be should the dirt hit the fan !

Brian, do you have details of the RN Spitfire loss you mentioned ?

Anyway, thanks for the input so far.

[Juha]

Hello Cheesey
Firstly, it was possible to get a hit from own artillery, IIRC one Typhoon was shot down by 25pdr or 5.5in shell during the opening day of the Operation Market-Garden. Also Lt Law, RN, claimed in 1978 that while directing fire of HMS Warspite on D-Day,his plane was almost hit by one 15in shell, after that he was quite careful to stay out of the line of fire.

Brian’s Seafire loss is probably that of Lt.Commander P.E.I. Bailey, CO of 886Sqn, shot down by “friendly” AA fire, baled out and landed on Allied beach, setting off a land mine but suffered only a sprained ankle. As one who had got a Pioneer training long time ago, I’d say if he stepped on anti-personel mine and didn’t get hurt more badly, he was extremely lucky.

Juha

[RyanShort1]

Liaison aircraft were also occasionally downed by their own artillery shells. Not very well documented, but I'm fairly certain it happened more than five times.

Ryan

[Leendert]

Spitfire AB794 (322 Squadron) reportedly was hit by Allied fire over Normandy and FTR on 12-6-1944?

Regards,

Leendert

[cheesey]

Hello Leendert.

Spitfire Vb AB794 Cat.E on ops, 12/06/1944. No.322 (Dutch) Sqn.RAF.

No mention in FC Losses and also no mention of loss in 322 Sqn. ORBs.Available here http://www.322squadron.com/operation1944.html

Squadron flew escort to Dakotas towing Waco gliders over Cherbourg Peninsula during evening. No losses. Was the only operation on that day due to weather problems.

Cheers.

[Stig Jarlevik]

Leendert/Cheesey

AB794 is listed as lost on the day stated and by AA fire but with 130 Sq
(Air Britain RAF Aircraft AA100-AZ999)

Franks claims this was W3946... while RAF Aircraft V1000 - W9999 says W3936 WAS indeed with 130Sq but SOC 22.6.1944

Cheers
Stig