mystery squadron with 2000 lbs

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello friends,

20th December 1942, Duisburg/Germany was bombed by RAF Bomber Command, squadrons were from 1, 3, 4, 5 and PFF Group.
The night raid report no.226 (AIR 14/3409) does specify the amount of explosives dropped on Duisburg:


35 x 4000 lbs. HC
6 x 2000 lbs. HC
8 x 1900 lbs.
291 x 1000 lbs.

(also lots of incendiaries but these are not relevant for my request for asking your help):

Group orders (AIR 25/1, 52, 93, 109A and 152) do specify the bombload for bombers of 1, 4, 5 and PFF, none of their bombers had 2000 lbs. bombs. Group orders for 3 Group do not specify the bombloads, thus suggesting that those 2000 lbs were dropped by one of its squadrons (in this night: 15, 75, 115, 149, 214 and 218 Squadron). However, from the ORB's of those squadrons who did send at least 6 or more bombers (15, 214 and 218) suggest that these Stirlings had no 2000 lbs. either !

Therefore 2 questions:
- is it a theoretical option, that a squadron (in other groups) instead of the ordered 4000 lbs. took 2000 lbs. with them? Or better:
- which squadron did carry 2000 lbs. during this raid?

Many thanks for any help someone could offer to solve the mystery. All the best and Merry Christmas,

Marcel Hogenhuis
www.fliegerhorst-venlo.net

[wellss]

6 Mosquitos of 109 squadron were dispatched to bomb a power station at Lutterade. This was an Oboe trial. The first Oboe-aimed bombs were dropped by Squadron Leader H. E. Bufton and his navigator Flight Lieutenant E. L. Ifould. 2 other crews bombed on Oboe but the equipment in the remaining 3 aircraft did not function properly and they bombed elsewhere. The Mosquitos all returned safely.

from The Bomber Command War Diaries

It doesn't say that 2000 lbs bombs were dropped, but the number of aircraft matches the number of bombs, so it's possible that each aircraft carried 1 x 2000 lbs bomb?

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Wells,

Thank you for responding and though it is tempting to connect 6 Mosquito's with these six 2000 lbs. it is unfortunately not correct:
these Mosquito's carried 500 lbs. bombs and only 3 were able to bomb the original target. The other 3 Mosquito's attacked Duisburg instead.

Best wishes, Marcel

[Steve Smith]

Marcel,

I am away from my files at the moment, but I remember reading that the dear old Stirling carried 2000lb bombs, not sure on this raid however.

Regards

Steve

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Dear Steve,

In these dark days for Christmas with lots of snow, your promising (but yet not conclusive) response does lighten up my hopes to find answers at last !!

Because I can imagine, that some ORB's did not specify the bombloads and just captured it in one word 'bombs', I hardly can imagine that where these bombloads explicitly were ordered by Group staff for its squadrons, one squadron took 2000 lbs instead of the ordered mix of 4000 lbs and incendiaries. Therefore my assumption remains a firm suspection, that 214 or 218 squadron carried those six 2000 lbs. to Duisburg.

We can exclude 15 and 149 Squadron, the first brought 'only' 5 bombers over Duisburg and they all bombed before 20.00 hours. Of 149 I only know at the moment that they have sent 5 Stirlings to Duisburg, further details not known yet.

214 Squadron had 6 Stirlings over Duisburg, they all bomber between 19.42 and 20.02, further details would be of tremendous help.

Well, any details you might be able to provide of the times over target and/or bomb load involved, would be much appreciated! You may contact me directly by: marcelhogenhuis@gmail.com

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

Marcel

[wellss]

The Stirling Story indicates that 26 Stirlings ( all in Main Force ) were sent on the Duisburg raid. 21 bombed the primary target. Bombs dropped were 43 x 1000 lbs, 3 x 500 lbs, 29300 4lb incendiary and 1410 4X incendiaries. All returned safely.

[Steve Smith]

Originally Posted by Marcel Hogenhuis

Dear Steve,

In these dark days for Christmas with lots of snow, your promising (but yet not conclusive) response does lighten up my hopes to find answers at last !!

Because I can imagine, that some ORB's did not specify the bombloads and just captured it in one word 'bombs', I hardly can imagine that where these bombloads explicitly were ordered by Group staff for its squadrons, one squadron took 2000 lbs instead of the ordered mix of 4000 lbs and incendiaries. Therefore my assumption remains a firm suspection, that 214 or 218 squadron carried those six 2000 lbs. to Duisburg.

We can exclude 15 and 149 Squadron, the first brought 'only' 5 bombers over Duisburg and they all bombed before 20.00 hours. Of 149 I only know at the moment that they have sent 5 Stirlings to Duisburg, further details not known yet.

214 Squadron had 6 Stirlings over Duisburg, they all bomber between 19.42 and 20.02, further details would be of tremendous help.

Well, any details you might be able to provide of the times over target and/or bomb load involved, would be much appreciated! You may contact me directly by: marcelhogenhuis@gmail.com

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

Marcel

Marcel,

I have checked both squadron ORB's and the No.3 Groups Operations Records Book Air25/67 and NO squadron from the group dropped a 2000lb bomb on this raid, sorry. !!

A Merry Christmas to you and Happy Research. !

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

hello Steve,

Again many thanks for your invaluable help: yesterday I received page 3 of the ORB of 214 Squadron, confirming at least for that squadron that 6 aircraft bombed Duisburg but all had 1000 lbs and/or 500 lbs. and lots of incendiaries.

For my overview of all individual aircraft involved that night, I don't hardly dare to ask whether you might provide me with the serials of the bombers which went to Duisburg from 75, 115, 149 and 214 Sqd. (17 in total) and their time over target ? The info for 15 and 218 Sqd. is complete. Just a simple list (squadron X, aircraft YYYYY, time WW.ZZ hours) would be sufficiant and much appreciated! You could use: marcelhogenhuis@gmail.com if you want.

Well, if 3 Group wasn't dropping 2000 lbs. bombs that night, my number of options have increased again where I finally hoped to narrow it down (grrrr...) It now seems to me that an unknown squadron took 2000 lbs. instead of the ordered 4000 lbs. with them.

Many thanks for your help! Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year from a snow covered Venlo,
Marcel

[Steve Smith]

Marcel,

I will email you details via the 3 Group Operations Book in the next few hours. I am away for a few days, so I hope this information will keep you going. It includes all the No.3 Group aircraft that took part, bombloads, bombing heights and a brief note by each crew.

Regards

Steve

[Steve Smith]

Marcel,

I have just posted the documents, forgot I have orders to go shopping !!!!!

Steve