eBay: Bf 109 two late war machines! Superb.

[ouidjat]

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Orig-Negativ-...item20d1d8526f
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Orig-Foto-Flu...item20d1d848b1

Enjoy.

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Excellent for awakening on Sunday;-))
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2809206...in/photostream
Bf 109 G-6 W.Nr. unknown "Schwarzer Winkel kleine 4", Stab III./JG 11, Oldenburg, Summer 1943. Source: Ebay via TOCH Forum.

the second is quite intriguing:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2809206...in/photostream
Bf 109 G-6 W.Nr. unknown "Schwarze 9", 2./JG 3 or 2./JG 4, Burg bei Magdeburg (?), early 1944. Source: Ebay auction via TOCH Forum. Note the Black White Black RV Band typical for JG 4. Is the engine cowling emblem indicative of the former unit of this Mtt-built machine?

Cheers and thanks!
Marc

[ouidjat]

Hello Guys,

Trapped?
Band width is not exactly what we could expect.
There is a III.Gruppe Balken behind the soldier in foreground.
And, is the dark band that black comparing with number "colour"?
???
No answer.

Regards, Franck.

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Franck,

This pic might be a good lead for understanding the particular "Schwarze 9" situation:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2809206...n/photostream/

There you can see graphically illustrated both JG 4 Fw 190 A-7's and a Bf 109 G of IV./JG 3. Both units, were stationed at Salzwedel between 29 February and 6 June 1944. An easy explanation for the borrowing by JG 4 of a replacement engine cowling from a JG 3 machine?

Cheers
Marc

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Franck,

As Anders points it out too, we could have a RLM 74 base painted over with the JG 3 white RV Band... The hue between the RLM 74 fuselage camouflage and the "black" band in front of the white is the same. Eagle eyes!

Cheers
Marc

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Hmm, Erratum...

Those Fw 190 A-7 are from Sturmstaffel 1; nothing to do with JG 4...

Sorry!
Marc

[ChristianK]

Hmmm... this particular fuselage band very much resembles the one of another Bf 109, which was found at Köthen in 1945 (see attachment). Perhaps there's more behind it than we think...

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Folks,

Thanks to Anders, Cpt_Farrel, here is an obviously similar machine, depicted at Leipheim, early 1944:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2809206...57631642353358
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2809206...7631642353358/
Bf 109 G-6 W.Nr. unknown, "Schwarze 9", 8./JG 3, Leipheim, mid March 1944. Source: Forsyth and Creek 2004, p. 95.

Anders thinks this might be actually the same plane.

@Christian,
Good spot as well. The only issue is the darker hue for the central band; it looks more like yellow (?)

Cheers
Marc

[ouidjat]

OK Guys,

You see?
- Christian spot a "good" one; But with TWO dark bands.
- Anders spot another good one, too.

If I/we take care of dimensions, proportions ... I 'd say that Anders got the point. But I'm not going to say - for the moment - that's the same plane.
Why did Anders got the point?
Because there is no place left for Black-White-Black.

Last, pictures put by Christian: Looks like darker than white; yes.

... I like that!

Regards Guys; Be good. So much work left to do.
Franck.

PS: Marc, don't be so fast! If not I give you my motto! By force!

[ouidjat]

Originally Posted by Marc-André Haldimann

Hmm, Erratum...

Those Fw 190 A-7 are from Sturmstaffel 1; nothing to do with JG 4...

Sorry!
Marc

Hmm...
By the contrary Marc. A lot if I understand books.
That is the main reason I wonder why that "Helm" emblem can be found on Bf 109s. I'm sure something missing (left behind) in available writings.
...
Regards, Franck.