FAF/RAF Losses May 1940

[Chris Goss]

Lt Julius Haase of 3/JG 53 claimed a Bloch-151 at 1235 hrs on 14 May 40, a Wellington (?) at 1945 hrs on 14 May 40 and two Bloch 151s at 1622 and 1625 hrs on 15 May 40. Can anyone give any ideas as to the possible identities?

[robert]

Perhaps:

14.05.40 12.35 MB-152 GCI/8
14.05.40 19.45 Blenheim 21/110 RAF
15.05.40 16.22 MB-152 GCII/1

Regards

Robert

[Chris Goss]

Thank you Robert. Do we have any details of the French losses? I guessed Wellington could have been Blenheims from those sqns

[Stéphane Lehuédé]

Hi

GC I/8 lost one MB.152 on 14 may 1940, but between 1215 (TO) & 1330 hrs (landing).

MB.152 n° 506 "10" damaged by Bf 109 & Flak, belly landed on return near Suippes. Sous-lieutenant Gouachon safe.

On 15 may 1940, GC II/1 was bounced by Bf 109s at about 1515 hrs.

MB.152 n° 178, severely damaged by Bf 109s near Charleville, landed at Couvron with not less than 360 bullet holes!! Capitaine Véniel safe.

MB.152 n° 122, damaged by Bf 109, force landed near Fraillicourt at about 1545 hrs. Lieutenant Brun safe.

MB.152 n° 189, shot down by Bf 109 near Monthermé, adjudant-chef Autier killed.

MB.152 n° 164, shot down by Bf 109 near Monthermé, adjudant-chef Munier killed.

Time & place seem to correspond to the claims of 3./JG 53

Capitaine Véniel claimed one Bf 109, crashed in Château-Regnault forest.


Sources : le Bloch MB-152, Serge Joanne, Lela Presse

Unfortunately, I have not "Ils étaient là", there's possibly more details.

Regards

[Peter Cornwell]

Hi Chris,

Just getting back on stream after disastrous computer failure which trashed my motherboard & modem etc. Here is what I have regarding the thread on possible HAASE claims:

14 May 1940 (extract)

GC I/8 Bloch 152 (506). Oil tank badly damaged in combat with Bf109s of 5./JG52 during escort sortie for Amiot 143s of GB I/34 over Sedan. Belly-landed alongside the road between Tahure and Suippes 1.00 p.m. S/Lt. P. Gouachon-Noireault unhurt. Aircraft a write-off.

GC I/8 Bloch 152 (531). Slightly damaged in combat with Bf109s of 5./JG52 during escort sortie for Amiot 143s of GB I/34 over Sedan; forced-landed at Bétheniville 1.00 p.m. Sgt. H. Choulet unhurt. Aircraft repairable.

15 May 1940 (extract)

GC II/1 Bloch 152 (164). Shot down in combat with Bf109s of 3./JG53 during bomber escort sortie, possibly that claimed by Oberfw. Kuhlmann. Crashed in the Château-Regnault forest, at Les Woieries, 3 km north-east of Monthermé 3.10 p.m. Sgt. R. Munier killed. Aircraft a write-off.
Capitaine Victor Veniel, Commandant of 3/1, claimed a Bf109 destroyed at this location during this combat but no such loss can be traced. The tragic conclusion that he may have inadvertently attacked the aircraft of René Munier can not be discounted.

GC II/1 Bloch 152 (189). Shot down in combat with Bf109s near Monthermé during bomber escort sortie, believed that claimed by Oberlt. Lippert (Staffelkapitän) of 3./JG53. Crashed at La Neuville-aux-Haies, in the Bois de Fays 3.13 p.m. Adjt. R. Autier killed. Aircraft a write-off.

GC II/1 Bloch 152 (122). Badly damaged in combat with Bf109s during bomber escort sortie over Monthermé and forced-landed between the lines at ‘Les-Petits-Hays’, Raillimont, outside Rozoy-sur-Serre 3.22 p.m. Believed that claimed by Lt. Haase of 3./JG53 Lt. Brun bruised left foot. Aircraft destroyed to prevent capture.

GC 3/1 Bloch 152. Returned to Laon-Couvron badly damaged in combat with Bf109s of 3./JG53 during bomber escort sortie over Monthermé 3.30 p.m. Capt. V. Veniel (Commandant) unhurt. Aircraft damaged but repairable.

Sorry if it confuses more than clarifies, but you know how these things are.

Peter C.

[robert]

Hi Peter,


and what you have on 08.06.40? On this day at 11.50 sw Beauvais pilots of 3/JG54 claimed 2 Curtis s/d. Have you matched any allied losses with this accident?

Regards

Robert

[Alain Picollet]

6 1/5 Curtisses were involved this day, between Rouen and Les Andelys, in a fight with a Ju87 formation heavily escorted by 12 Bf110. The French loses were Sous-Lieutenant Rouquette force-landed in a damaged a/c ; Alois Vatsako force-landed too, a/c w-o. None was injured.

[Peter Cornwell]

I am unable to relate any losses to the claims by SCHMOLLER-HALDY & KRANZ on 8.6.40. Neither, I note, does the eminent M. Gillet.

M. Picollet offers an interesting option although I have this particular action timed around 3.30 pm viz. some 4 - 5 hours after the claims filed by 3./JG54.

And is it good practice to 'hi-jack' threads so with separate topics ?