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Allied and Soviet Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the Air Forces of the Western Allies and the Soviet Union.

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Old 31st July 2011, 14:31
SteveB SteveB is offline
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213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

Hi

On 15 July 1944 four Mustangs of 213 Sqn ran in to six s/e biplanes "Bucker types" over Vukovar and the pilots shot down four of them. The biplanes had black and yellow checks on the rudder and green-grey camouflage overall.

Has anybody ever identified what unit the Bucker-types came from? I thought the subject had been discussed here before or over on RAF Commands but I cannot find anything. I had a note of a site that lists war time losses over Yugoslavia but it does not seem to work anymore.

Any help greatly appreciated

Steve
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Old 31st July 2011, 15:39
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: 213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

From Oberbefehlshaber Südost (Heeresgruppe F) daily report for 15 July 1944 (in: NARA WashDC - RG 242, Microcopy T-311, roll 192, frame 0009):

"Allied fighters attacked the airfields at Sarajevo and Borovo. One (1) Croatian aircraft was strafed on the ground at Sarajevo-Rajlovac and destroyed. Over Borovo, 1 Croatian Bücker trainer was shot down, 4 damaged and 1 is missing." (my translation)

The date is the same, the enemy aircraft type is the same, Borovo is 5.6 km N of Vukovar, and the Croatian Air Force used a red and white checkerboard square on the tail. The Borovo Pilot School had just graduated its last class of 26 students on 12 July and the graduate pilots flying the Bücker trainers were getting in a last practice flight before being assigned to 4. Jato/2 Skupina at Sarajevo-Rajlovac.

I am guessing the Allies in Italy knew all about what was going on at Borovo through ULTRA and an attack was laid on.

L.
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Old 31st July 2011, 17:28
SteveB SteveB is offline
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Re: 213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

Thanks Larry for the excellent information!

The 213Sq diary records four aircraft at Vukovar/Borovo "one flamer in the air the remaining crashed" which perhaps fits better with the German records. They also record one Do217/Do17 left on fire at Sarajevo.

You may well be correct about the possible ULTRA link but the write up of the operation suggests that it was just another low-level armed reconnaissance around the river valleys and railway lines and they happened to run into the Buckers in the air.

Thanks again

Steve
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Old 31st July 2011, 17:41
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: 213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

The Do 17 at Sarajevo-Rajlovac was also Croatian AF.

By mid-summer 1944, the Balkan Air Force was all over the Axis air assets in Yugoslavia like flies on you-know-what. In addition to ULTRA and lower level codes and ciphers used by the Germans and Croatians, the Allies (mainly Brits) had liaison teams with many if not most of the Partisan brigades and these teams radioed intelligence information gathered by the Partisans back to Italy. This is just a guess, but they probably had spotters and moles at the various air bases around the country who knew exactly what was going on 24/7.

Glad to help,

L.
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Old 1st August 2011, 09:41
SteveB SteveB is offline
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Re: 213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

Thanks again Larry for your thoughts on this.

Can I just check am I correct in translating your information that "Heeresgruppe F" indicates German Army records rather than Luftwaffe records?

Steve
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Old 1st August 2011, 12:58
Larry deZeng Larry deZeng is offline
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Re: 213 Sqn claims over Vukovar 15 July 1944

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveB View Post
Thanks again Larry for your thoughts on this.

Can I just check am I correct in translating your information that "Heeresgruppe F" indicates German Army records rather than Luftwaffe records?

Steve
Yes, Steve. H.Gr. F (OB Südost) was Heer (Army) and the supreme threater command for the entire Balkans with HQ in Belgrade. The supreme Luftwaffe command for the Balkans was Luftwaffenkommando Südost with HQ in Belgrade-Pancevo. Unfortunately, its records did not survive the war.

Larry
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