JG 5 Walking stick with killer markings!!

[Chrille]

I got this original walking stick filled with killer markings and dates, but it appears like it has been a non pilot done this probably a ground crew? The name G schnell is written on one side. This because the killings is for many different pilots.

best Chris

[Delmenhorst]

You are a very Lucky person. Congratulations ..

[Johannes]

I'll look into the claiments/claiment

It is curious as Il-2's were rarely claimed by JG 5 I assume they were not used much in the north, just as Boston's/Airacobra's and P-40's were more common in the north.

Kind Regards

Johannes

P.S I cannot by memory ever recall a SU-2 being claimed in the north!

[Delmenhorst]

Just a single day from Tony Wood:

10.01.43 Uffz. Goscht 9./JG 5 Pe-2 37 Ost/10 481: 300 m.
10.01.43 Fw. Walter Schuck 9./JG 5 Curtiss P-4037 Ost/10 282: 1.500 m.
10.01.43 Ofw. Helmut Kischnick 9./JG 5 Il-2 37 Ost/30 421 at 50 m.
10.01.43 Fw. Walter Schuck 9./JG 5 Il-2 37 Ost/30 319 at 50 m.
10.01.43 Fhj. Schnippert 9./JG 5 Il-2 37 Ost/30 594 at 50 m.

[Johannes]

Hi

I checked "stick" against JG 5's claims and it doesn't match at all.

The Luftwaffe made no claims at all against Soviet SU-2's on 5th March 1943. No Il-2 claims for JG 5 on 22nd August 1943 & 29th March 1943, only one on 25th March 1943. Only Pe-2 claim on 10th March 1943 was by Hans Reiff of 8./JG 3, and no claims at all for JG 5.

Matches varied between 7th,8th and 9th Staffels of JG 5.

Regards

Johannes

[John Manrho]

The stick was also discussed on another board and I also came to this conclusion and suggested that it could be a fraud. If the owner can not trace the history back to the original owner and paid a reasonable sum for it, than I would doubt it even more.

John

[Andreas Brekken]

Hello, all

I believe this can be from a Flak unit - and not JG 5. I have yet to go through the claims from Flak units at Petsamo - have looked at some for Kirkenes in the same period.

Regards,
Andreas B

[Chrille]

Hello! Thanks for your help Andreas ,I did get this info : " The dates are 100% sure belonging to pilots in 5,6-8 staffel JG 5 , stationed in Kirkenes,petsamo and Salmijärvi. Probably it belonged to groundcrew at Petsamo."

It is original, for those who doubts it.

best C

[Andreas Brekken]

Hi, all

Partial matches exist - working from a secondary source today - Eric Mombeek's Jagdgeschwader 5 books:

05.03.1943 SU 2 Lt. Schumann, Friedrich III./JG 5 Pe-2 (29. BAP WWS SF)
10.03.1943 Il 2 No claims for Pe-2 or Il-2 on this date, but Alakurtti was attacked by Pe-2s of 80. BAP and Il-2s of 828. SchAP, so it is possible that these claims are from III. Gruppe but not found in the claims list in archives today.
10.03.1943 See previous entry
18.03.1943 Il 2 Fw Beyer, Heinz 8./JG 5 Il-2 (Kpt. Peretjagin 17 gwSchAP 258. SchAD)
25.03.1943 Il 2 Fw Schuck, Walter 9./JG 5 Il-2 (Petsamo)
25.03.1943 Il 2 Fw. Hans Döbrich 6./JG 5 - ohne Zeugen - nicht Anerkannt
29.03.1943 Il 2 No claims for Il-2, one Pe-2 by Fw. Luy, Richard 9./JG 5. But the Alarmrotte of 7./JG 5 was also in the air and claimed one Il-2 close to Petsamo. It is possible that more claims were carved in but is either missing or was not filed.
29.03.1943 Il 2 See above
29.03.1943 Il 2 See above
04.04.1943 Il 2 Lt Rost, Wolfgang 7./JG 5 Il-2. Alarmstart in Petsamo.
22.08.1943 Il 2 I think the claims record for this date is missing - all parts of JG 5 in the east flew multiple sorties this day. It could also be that the person who carved this entered the wrong date as the units flew sorties almost around the clock to protect a convoi of ships and there are multiple claims related to the following day.
22.08.1943 Il 2 See above
22.08.1943 Il 2 See above
27.09.1943 Il 2 Three claims for Il-2 on this date, two by Fw. Klante, Helmut and one by Fw. Fiedler, Reinhold - both 7./JG 5
27.09.1943 P 40 Fw. Klante, Helmut 7./JG 5 Curtiss P-40

So - I take back the probably Flak statement and accept that this could be genuine and connected most probably to III./JG 5 operations in the vicinity of Petsamo.

Regards,
Andreas B