Trying to ID photos of crashed 109 down near "Sedan" during winter 39-40

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

Can anyone ID this 109 crash in France, probably in 1939?

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...#ht_1328wt_926

Based no leaves on tree/bush limbs this must have happened during the winter of 1939-40, sometime between late-Nov., 39 and early spring 1940. Soldiers look French, and caption on back says near Sedan. Underwing cross looks more like 39 than 40 to me.

[Rasmussen]

The caption says the picture was found near Sedan ... it doesn't mean the picture was taken near Sedan.

regards
Rasmussen

[Larry Hickey]

Rasmussen,

Thanx. Good point.

Someone else sent me a direct msg that they think this is an Hs126, not a 109. Still need to ID it and still almost certainly France during the Phony War.

Regards,

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

I now have PM from several people giving an accurate translation of the caption on the back of these photos. It says that this was found (presumably by a German soldier) in a trench near Sedan. So, the actual crash site, as Rasmussen noted above, may have nothing to do with the Sedan area, but could still well be in that area. The soldiers are French, so this is pretty certainly an Hs126 loss in western France on a recon mission during the winter of 1939-40. With this information, does anyone have any good candidates for this loss?

Thanx,

[Andy Saunders]

Western France?

[Markus]

Hi Larry,

I think also - this is Hs126 from period winter 39-40. I wrote out (from the BofF -Cornwell) all losses Hs 126 which are over on French side front.

30.10.39 1.(H)/13 Rehlingen
31.10.39 4.(H)/22 Creutzwald
19.4.40 2.(H)/13 Balgau

Another incidents (combat/non combat) in this period were not on allied territory. Next first incident was in may 40! Your scout will in between them.

Good strike (e-bay). I wanted this prints also.

Marek

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

Another source in a direct email listed these Hs126s as being shot down by French fighters during the Phoney War over eastern France:


10-10-39 GC I/3 MS 406 Walsheim
30-10-39 GC III/2 MS 406 Bad Bergzabern
30-10-39 GC II/5 Curtiss Rehlingen
31-10-39 GC II/4 Curtiss Offenburg (SW Germany near the Rhine river)

19-4-40 GC II/7 MS 406 Balgau

Source comment: "It seems that after heavy losses in October the Germans realized it was all too unhealthy to risk their Hs 126s against French fighter opposition. Certainly the RAF got some of them too. From April on the information probably was too vital not to take a risk again. Except Offenburg I think all locations were in the Belgian-Lxbg-Germany-France area (NE France)."

And Andy, yes, I should have said eastern France.

Since I live in the USA I'm not familiar enough with the climate on the French/German boarder area to judge if the leaves were off the bushes and trees as early as the end of October, 1939, to be consistent with the photos. Likewise, by 19 April 1940, would the leaves have been coming back on the trees by then?

Marcus/Marek, send me a PM and we might be able to work out something on the photos. If you are the Marek that I already know, just send me an email.

Regards,

[Larry Hickey]

Hello,

Further study of this question indicates that the RAF did not claim any Hs126s along the French/German boarder during the Phoney War. This could have been a loss caused by AA fire, but if it was caused by French fighters, as appears likely, then it is probably one of these three losses:

30.10.39 1.(H)/13 Rehlingen
30.10.39 4.(H)/22 Creutzwald
19.4.40 2.(H)/13 Balgau

October 30, 1939:
1.(H)/13 Henschel Hs126B-1. Possibly that attacked near Rehlingen by Capt Reyne of GC II/5 during observation sortie to Creutzwald. Both crew unhurt. Aircraft 60% damaged but repairable.

4.(H)/22 Henschel Hs126B-1. Believed shot down by S/Lt Plubeau of GC II/4 during observation sortie west of Creutzwald. Uffz Carsten Carstens killed, other crewman believed unhurt. Aircraft 100% write-off.

April 19, 1940:
2.(H)/13 Henschel Hs126B-1 (3027). Shot down by Moranes of GC II/7 during observation mission south of Neuf-Breisach and crashed near Dessenheim. (Beo) Lt Wilhelm Hellmann, and (Ff) Gefr Hermann Meissner both killed. Aircraft 4E+BK 100% write-off.

The first one was apparently not a crash, leaving only the second and third as likely candidates for this incident.

We may have to get to the likely candidate through a process of elimination. So, can anyone, either through photos or information, eliminate any of these as possibilities for this loss?

Regards,