Some Lw pilots claims prior Barbarossa

[Dmitry Volodin]

Comparing J.Perry’s victory list and J.Prien’s list (from JFV 6/I,II) I found some discrepancies in victory numbers. Could anybody resolve this problem concerning claims prior Barbarossa (until 22.06.41)?

Oblt. Michalek Georg II./JG3 – 0 or 11? (in JG54?)
Ltn. Mertens Helmut III./JG3 – 3 or 4?
Hptm. Dobislav Max III./JG27 – 7 or 9?
Oblt. Lohoff Helmut III./JG51 – 1 or 3? (in I./JG77)
Fw. Baumann Helmut II./JG51 – 0 or 1?
Oblt. Beise Günther Stab/JG51 – 0 or 1?
Fw. Bielefeldt Werner III./JG51 – 2 or 3?
Oblt. Emmerich Peter IV./JG51 – 1 or 5?
Fw. Fuchs Robert III./JG51 – 1 or 3?
Oblt. Jung Harald III./JG51 – 1 or 5?
Ltn. Mayerl Maximilian III./JG51 – 4 or 5?
Gefr. Müller Gustl IV./JG51 – 0 or 4?
Oblt. Schumann Heinz I./JG51 – 1 or 6?
Uffz. Theimann Wilhelm I./JG51 – 0 or 1?
Hptm. Hörnig Franz III./JG52 – 0 or 1?
Fw. Kühn Walter I./JG52 – 0 or 1?
Hptm. Werra von Franz I./JG53 – 5 or 8?
Oblt. Kinzinger Adolf-Waldemar I./JG54 – 7 or 8?
Uffz. Masterer Leopold II./JG54 – 5 or 6?
Stfw. Goedert Helmut I.(J)/LG2 – 0 or 4?
Uffz. Gromotka Fritz II./JG27 – 2 or 3?
Oblt. Hahn Otto II./JG77 – 1 or 2?
Ltn. Omert Emil III./JG77 – 2 or 3?
Ltn. Brandis Felix-Maria Z./JG77 – 3 or 4?

Thanks in advance
Dmitry

[Nokose]

I would stick with Prien's JFV series on that as he corrected even his unit books (JG3, JG53, etc). Tony Woods list does have the heights of the claims though and that helps in checking eastern front claims especially when there is more then one claim in an area.

[Dmitry Volodin]

Checking Prien's 4/I I found the following:
1) Max Dobislav III./JG27 - 8 claims westfront + 1 claim Malta (J.Perry's list)
2) Fritz Gromotka II./JG27 - 2 claims westfront + 1 claim Balkans (J.P. list)
3) Helmut Mertens III./JG3 - 3 claims westfront, but ostfront claims starts with #5
4) Franz von Werra II./JG3 - 8 claims westfront, but ostfront claims starts with #6, maybe 3 claims on 28.08.40 was rejected later?
5) Peter Emmerich IV./JG51 - 1 claims westfront, but ostfront claims starts with #5, maybe 3 claims achieved in E.Gr.210?
Unfortunately I have Prien's 4/I only and cannot check other persons in 4/II.

[Nokose]

Dmitriy by the western front are you also referring to the fighting some of these units did in the Balkins campaign.

[Dmitry Volodin]

Yes, under "west" I mean all fronts: Poland,Norway, France, BoB.

[Nokose]

Dmitry,
My volumes of the JFV start with 6/I. I'll give you what I can find. Starting with Lt. Franz von Werra from J.Prien's "Jagdgeschwader 3 "Udet" in World War II"
(1) Hurricane 20May40 16:29
(2)Breguet 690 22May40 12:36
(3) Breguet 690 22May40 12:52
(4) Morane 03Jun40 ? hrs
(5) Spitfire 28Aug40 ? hrs.
(6) Hurricane 28Aug40 ?
(7)Hurricane 28Aug40 ?
(8) Hurricane 28Aug40 ?
I believe he didn't start claiming again until his escape and return to Germany at which time he started again in Russia. His claims for the 28Aug40 are probably very doubtiful but maybe someone else can give a better opinion.

[Nokose]

I remember reading something in a Biography about him for the 28Aug40. The three Hurricanes were suppose to be taking off or landing when he shot them down but he had no witness. It still was printed by the German press as true and he changed his story during interrogation by the RAF on being captured. So maybe 5 victories before Russia.

[Dmitry Volodin]

OK, von Werra - 5 claims.
Just checked Georg Michalek in JFV: Poland - 0, Sitzkrieg (I./JG54) - 0, France - 0, Battle of Britain - 0. Why first ostfront claim is #12?