Junkers W34 (See)

[obdl3945]

Hi...

Is anyone able to complete the code for the aircraft shown in the image below? Seems to have been assigned to 3./Kü.Fl.Gr.506 if the emblem on the forward fuselage is anything to go by.

Any assistance would be much appreciated.

Image is from an expired e-bay auction of some years ago.

Regards,

Paul

[ju55dk]

PQ+AG.

Junker

[stevehnz]

The unit codes for KuFkGr 506 should have been S4 according to my refs. I can see none that were PQ. The only ~Q codes appear to be #Q eg 2Q which was NAGr 15, 4Q, verbindungstaffel 7 Flieger div, 6Q SchG 151, 8Q Transportgruppe 10 & 9Q Fliegerverbindungsgeschwader 2. These according to Merrick Vol.2 Its a stunning picture though & the modeller in me says , hell but I'd like to do one of those. RLM 72/73/65 or 70/71/65? That is the question
Steve.

Edited to say I'm probably guilty of misunderstanding the info in Merrick there are many photos with 2 letter codes so there is obviously something I'm missing, some more reading required.

[ju55dk]

This W 34 does not carry a Vkz of 506. It has a Skz wich is a 4 letter registration.

Junker

[stevehnz]

Can you please explain Vkz & Skz, I'm not familiar with those & nothing I'm getting out of Merrick Vol 2 is making sense of this so far?
Steve

[obdl3945]

Hi, Steve...

Thanks for your contribution... you're not wrong in what you say about the standard operational code of Kü.Fl.Gr.506 being 'S4', but Junker is also correct in differentiating between Stkz and Vkz.

By way of explanation, an alpha-numeric code for say, 3./Kü.Fl.Gr.506 may have been S4+?L, where '?' is the individual aircraft I/D, and 'L' the indicator for 3.Staffel. This is a Vkz - Verbandkennzeichen, which we might take to be the code of an operational front line unit.

A code such as the one applied to this Ju W34 (See), PQ+AG, is a Stkz - Stammkennzeichen. As I understand it, these were allocated by the factory building the aircraft. A block of codes, ie PQ+AA to PQ+AZ, would not necessarily have been applied entirely to Ju W34s, although any given portion of codes within the block may well have been allocated to one type, built by one company. This complicates matters as it is rarely possibly to presume, for example, that the aircraft preceding or following the one in my photo - PQ+AF or PQ+AH would also have been assigned to the same unit since the factory would allocate codes as the aircraft left the production line, but the first one may have gone to a training unit, the fourth to a test centre such as Rechlin, and yet another within the block of codes to say, a fighter unit as a liaison aircraft. I suspect that was the role of the aircraft in the photo, where it clearly shows a Stkz, but also the unit insignia of an operational front line unit.

If you're looking for more information on the different types of code, I can recommend the LEMB's Stammkennzeichen database, http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/stammkennzeichen.html. LEMB is another very good website with a forum, if you're not already aquainted with it. The database is a free access one. It is not a complete list of codes, but it is a list of known alphabetic codes, and also the civil-registered nationality codes, 'D-xxxx' and the Wermacht-Luft 'WL-xxxx' codes.

In addition, you can try www.luftarchiv.de, and from the left side menus, select the following: Luftfahrtindustre, then Motorflugzeug, then 1939.1945. There you will see the standard structure of operational front line unit codes, with their appropriate colour coding as well. I doubt German is overly necessary to understand it as it does follow a pattern... admittedly, one it took me 10 years to sort in my mind, but I was very young at the time and the internet hadn't been invented then!

As ever, there were many anomalies with Luftwaffe codes, and only experience will teach you what they are and how to interpret the information you come across. Hope this is of help to you.

Kindest regards,

Paul

[stevehnz]

Paul, thank you for demystfying this for me (a bit ) with your nicely put together explanation. The fact that I think I have got my head around the basics of it shows you explained the topic in a very easy to comprehend way, otherwise I'd still be totally confused. I'd heard of the Stammkennzeichen before, though I wasn't familiar with the abbreviations of these & the Verbandkennzeichen. Those two links were new to me though I am registered on LEMB though I tend to be a plunderer rather than contributor. The info in them is very useful in sorting this subject out. I've thought previously that the Skz was removed when a plane was allocated to an operational unit, though it appears that they may not have been for aircraft in secondary roles in such units as this one. Oh well another building block in place, on wards & upwards.
Thanks again,
Steve.

[obdl3945]

Hi, Steve...

Glad the explanation was helpful. I should just add that most times, an operational unit would overpaint the Stkz, but sometimes aircraft were needed urgently and would go strainght into action with their Stkz still in place, or in the case of, say, Ju87s photographed on the Eastern Front, the Vkz codes are put in place on the fuselage, but the Stkz is left in situ under the wings.

Regards,

Paul

[stevehnz]

Originally Posted by obdl3945

Hi, Steve...

the Vkz codes are put in place on the fuselage, but the Stkz is left in situ under the wings.

Regards,

Paul

Which really confuses the hell out of people like me.
Paul thanks for your input, I may never be an experten but bit by bit with help from people like you I'm at least finding where to look for the pit falls.
Steve.