WWII Aircraft Dump Pacific

[kaki3152]

A nice link to some great nose art. Most are B24s from the 90th BG but there are also a P-38, A-20s and C-47s. Its about half way down the page.

http://usafflagranks.com/Major_Gener...s_McMullen.htm

[BubbaND1]

Definitely some nice pictures! Also provides some interesting info regarding the immense amount logistics needed during and at the end of the war. Thanks for the link.

[John Beaman]

Nice collections. If you ever wonder what American airman were fighting for, look at the WWII section. Nothing about "For Roosevelt", "For Democracy", or anything like that. Just lots of semi-clad ladies. Certainly something to fight for and get home to!

[Nick Hector]

John, some of them couldn't even wait to get home and that's putting it politely.

Google "battle of Brisbane", you'll see how some of their allies felt about US soldier's attitudes toward their women whilst 'guests' in their country.
...Not nearly as nice as mom's apple pie.
Quote: "Don't worry mate, we'll look after your sheilas" (in mock Australian accent)

Nick

[Larry deZeng]

Shocking, Nick, absolutely shocking, but could we perhaps suggest that this might be a case of forming opinions and making judgments ex-post-facto and out of context with the times? Incidents like Brisbane have happened countless times over the centuries when you pack large numbers of servicemen into a small city or large town that has too few women to go around and then fuel them all with alcohol. Both governments knew this in 1941-42 when they negotiated the garrisoning of U.S. troops on Australian soil, so the Australian government at the time had the opportunity to demand severe restrictions or outright ban the presence of American military from your country. They should have also demanded that an Australian general and staff direct and command the war in the Southwest Pacific, otherwise Australian forces would not participate. MacArthur's autocratic personality and propensities were well known long before the war.

The fair and balanced Wiki article on the "Battle" that I just read apportioned blame to both sides. Did the author get that wrong? Were the Australian troops in Brisbane all tea-drinking alcohol shunners dressed in designer uniforms with little lace hankies tucked in their breast pockets, or were they tough, grizzled, scarred, hard drinking veterans of Greece, Crete and Cyrannaica who jumped at the chance to kick some Yankee butt?

As I already said, this sort of undisciplined behavior was not uncommon and you can find hundreds of reports of drunken troops fighting in old newspapers from around the world. From my own personal experiences, I vividly remember the fights we used to get into in the bar district of downtown Mannheim in 1958. As usual, it was over girls or an ill-advised remark. The aggressors were almost always men from the 510th Tank Battalion from Sullivan Barracks who arrived in large numbers by Straßenbahn, stuck together, and went bar-to-bar looking for trouble. Every attractive female 15 to 25 in Mannheim belonged to them, or so they thought. Rarely more than a few nights went by without a bar getting busted up and guys laying in the street with serious injuries from beer bottles and flying furniture. This happened frequently in just about every garrison city in Germany until the drawdown began in 1993-94. Oh, and there wasn’t an Aussie in sight. The British Army of the Rhine in NW Germany had similar problems with their own men.

It’s what soldiers do, Nick. They fight.

Next time, have your MP tell Canberra not to invite the Yanks! As for 1942, I think the Parliamentarians and the public were a little panicky by the unfolding events to their north and west and chose MacArthur in preference to Hisaichi Terauchi and his boys with their nasty Model 30 Arisaka bayonets with their 16” blades.

Just thinking my country and servicemen should have a say in this, too.

Best regards,

Larry

[Nick Hector]

Larry,
Easy, friend (meant sincerely by the way and not sarcastically).
My comments were not an invitation for you to lump me in the same boat as the "yankee go home" crowd that some of my compatriots feel the need to affirm with. I won't be lobbying my local MP anytime soon, because truth be known he belongs to a party whose voters are often of that ilk and as such, you couldn't get me to vote for him if you held a pen in my hand against a ballot paper whilst I was suffering an apoplectic fit.
In my opinion, poorly-informed is the Australian who does not acknowledge the United States' role in the defence of our country and poorly-informed is the American who thinks Australia would have been invaded, occupied and never liberated without American intervention. Fact: the Japanese never seriously countenanced an invasion of the Australian continent. They could only have planned to do that if the war had gone in their favour for longer than what it did. Consequently, it is an exaggeration to claim that MacArthur and his troops were the liberators of Australia and more fair to state the fact that the country gave him a more convenient base of operations.
I note that you are an ex-US serviceman. I am ex-RAAF, served 7 years and am now a civilian working in the defence industry. I served with USMC personnel on several exercises and whereas 7 years' service is not as many as some, I've seen the good the bad and the ugly of it all.
A point for you to consider: Americans come to places like Australia, the UK and Germany to conduct exercises etc. But in return Australian, British and German troops do not go the US to do the same, certainly not in such great numbers. Is it any wonder therefore that I saw the following conversations/situations take place:
USMC: You guys have a nice country here. RAAF: Yeah mate, when do all of us get to come to yours?
USMC CO in a thankyou and farewell speech to RAAF personnel: There are allies, there are friends and then there are F R I E N D S and you guys are true friends. Muttered comment from one RAAF serviceman to another: "Wonder if he'd say that if we were all over there chasing their women." ....And Australian-US relationships certainly weren't helped by the fact that there were many among them that actually did not know that Australians had served in Vietnam. A great way to reduce your welcome in an allied country is to forget that country's involvement in a war that the two of you fought together LOL
Please, I would hate for you to think I don't take your point that Australian soldiers were not tea-drinking alcohol shunners dressed in designer uniforms with little lace hankies tucked in their breast pockets, or were they tough, grizzled, scarred, hard drinking veterans of Greece, Crete and Cyrenaika who jumped at the chance to kick some Yankee butt.
To clear up any misconception that I am somebody who thinks his country's soldiers are forever and always angels... One of the worst, most disgusting instances of undisciplined behaviour that I have ever heard of was perpetrated by Australian soldiers in 1915: the so-called "battle of the Wazzir." The mythology of that sordid episode long held to the contention that it was a case of Australian troops cleaning up the sin and debauchery that was parts of Cairo. One or two publications were released in recent years that quoted the actual court of inquiry which showed in fact, it was a case of two Australians demanding money from Egyptian prostitutes and it all snowballing from there. Why were they demanding money from these prostitutes? They blamed the girls for giving them VD and felt that the resulting suspension in pay whilst they were being treated for it was something they had a right to expect the girls to reimburse them for. If it's not disgusting enough that a soldier educated in the medical effects of VD and the disciplinary measures attached to getting oneself infected with it, then proceeds to go and engage in the activities most likely to cause it and THEN blame the girl... ...It's even more sickening to demand money from her and physically assault her and destroy her property (because, yes, that is what really happened). A small riot then ensued as the situation escalated and said riot became mythologised as " good clean Australians cleaning up filthy Cairo." Absolutely sickening.
Quote: It’s what soldiers do, Nick. They fight.
Response: Yes, Larry. But well-disciplined soldiers fight on the battlefield. Poorly disciplined soldiers fight off the battlefield, in places such as the "Wazzir" and the instances in Mannheim mentioned by yourself.
Quote: Just thinking my country and servicemen should have a say in this, too.
Response: As hinted at above, that say would be received more warmly if temporary occupation was a two-way street.