Me 262 on eBay

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by ouidjat

Hi All,

Can you go deeper Nick, please?
Thank you for your comments.

Cheers, Franck.

Not much deeper to go. I half-remembered some reference to Me 262 conversion (and repair?) work being done in DLH workshops, and I wondered if that's what David meant.

[D.B. Andrus]

Originally Posted by David E. Brown

Hi Roland,

I agree that the aircraft in the photos is "Red 1". However, its camouflage and markings, and that of the other aircraft adjacent to it, “White 12”, indicate both aircraft are from the 1133xx series. Note that the werknummer was only applied to the base of the port side of the fin.

In the 26 April 1945 München-Riem Me 262 list, the following werknummern are indicated for seven (7) aircraft assigned to JV 44:
113331
113334
113337
113343
113344
113357
113365

In the second part of the list, aircraft undergoing "conversion" at the DHL facilities there include seven (7) others from this series:
113337
113338
113340
113354
113357
113359
113371

Two other aircraft are indicated (O’Connell, 2005) to have been discovered at Innsbruck-Hötting but interestingly are not listed on the Me 262 document: 113368 and 113369.

It is interesting that 113371 ended up at Innsbruck-Hötting, and two others - 113331 and 113357 - were also listed in the JV 44 section of the document. It is probable that they were with the unit and listed in error as still with DHL.

Based on the above, it would appear that both "Red 1" and "White 12" found at Innsbruck are from the 1133xxx werknummer series, and that the former is one of the aforementioned werknummers as listed for JV 44 aircraft.

Cheers,

David

David

PM sent.

Cheers,

Damian

[David E. Brown]

Hi Nick,

Yes, damn those corporate abbreviations and acronyms! Too many and too confusing. DLH is what I meant.

Regarding the 'conversions' taking place there, I seem to recall writing something about this. I think my comclusion was that standard A-1a Jäger aircraft sourced directly from the respective manufacturers were being upgraded to the multi-purpose A-2a Jabo variant. This would entail the addition of the ETC 501 bomb racks as well as adding of the cockpit armoured plate (attached to the canopy) and other minor tweaks. I should think that this is a subject that needs some definitive answers.

Cheers,

David

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by David E. Brown

Hi Nick,

I think my comclusion was that standard A-1a Jäger aircraft sourced directly from the respective manufacturers were being upgraded to the multi-purpose A-2a Jabo variant. This would entail the addition of the ETC 501 bomb racks as well as adding of the cockpit armoured plate (attached to the canopy) and other minor tweaks. I should think that this is a subject that needs some definitive answers.

Cheers,

David

Hi David,

I've just finished Robert Forsyth's latest for Osprey and something like that struck me. Authors are unanimous that to carry bombs the A-2a had two cannon removed and a supplementary fuel tank installed - to address weight and c.g. issues. So how come KG 51 operated increasing numbers of 4-cannon machines as time went on? The usual way to overcome weight/payload problems is to fit a more powerful engine, so did they wring extra power out of the Jumo 003 or what?

[Richard T. Eger]

Dear All,

Regarding the DLH conversion facility at Munich-Riem, the April 26, 1945 document says no more, no less, except that a specific group of Me 262's was there. No reason is given as to why.

As for bomber versions having 4 MK 108, the original distinction between fighters with 4 MK 108 and bombers with 2 MK 108 was eliminated as the war progressed, with aircraft for both end uses having 4 MK 108. The Me 262 suffered from a too rearward CG. It wasn't very long into service that a rear 600 liter fuel tank was added, adding to the CG problem. However, with the added weight in the nose of the bomber version, this likely helped balance out the CG problem. Even then, careful adherence as to how much to fill the 600 l tank given the specific configuration had to be adhered to. Ironically, IIRC, the orders were to fill the 600 l tank even less if bombs were mounted. I never understood why.

So, what was happening to the Me 262's at the DLH shop a Munich-Riem? Well, if these were for JV 44, then why equip them with bombs, unless they were to be employed in the close support bombing role? They could have been in the shop for repairs or finishing up being fitted out. Or, my favorite thesis, that they were being equipped with R4M racks.

Regards,
Richard