Lysander losses 2 Squadron RAF, May 1940

[B.F.M. Droog]

Does anyone know how many Westland Lysanders were with 2 Squadron on 10/05/1940?

One source stated: '2 Squadron went into Belgium with seventeen Lysanders and, so as to provide the widest cover for the B.E.F., dispersed about three aircraft to each of the airfields at Abbeville, Bethune, Roncq, Lille and Brussels.' (...) 'By the time of the Dunkirk evacuation the Squadron had scarcely a servicable Lysander left.'

Yet after studying Peter Cornwell's 'The Battle of France Then and Now', 2008 I counted 'only' three planes lost and four damaged (but repairable) before Dunkirk. During Dunkirk the Squadron lost 2 a/c. and one Lysander was damaged, but repairable.

As I didn't find in the CWGC Database any 2 Squadron Casualties missed by Peter Cornwell, I wonder what's the case here. I can think of only these possibilities:

1. The statements 'went into Belgium with seventeen Lysanders' and 'By the time of the Dunkirk evacuation the Squadron had scarcely a servicable Lysander left' are wrong.
2. An unknown number of Lysanders was lost on the ground during German bombings or abandoned (which is unlikely, as Cornwell would have mentioned it, as is the case with other squadrons).
3. The damaged aircraft couldn't be repaired in time.

What's your opinion on this?

Regards,

Bart

[Peter Cornwell]

There were five squadrons of Lysanders in France on May 10, 1940, with a total of 90 aircraft between them. Thus, squadron establishment was 18 aircraft apiece.

Source: Appendix D, Appendices & Maps - RAF Narrative, The Campaign In France & The Low Countries.

[B.F.M. Droog]

Thanks Peter (and my humble compliments for your splendid book; it arrived yesterday).

So the 'seventeen Lysanders' for 2 Squadron could be correct. Have you any idea if the 'By the time of the Dunkirk evacuation the Squadron had scarcely a servicable Lysander left' statement is correct? If so, what happened to all these planes?

Regards,

Bart

[Peter Cornwell]

Bart,

Thanks for your comments on the book, I hope you get much from it.

I challenge the statement that No.2 Squadron had few aircraft serviceable by the time of Dunkirk. Analysis of aircraft allotted to the squadron reveals no losses beyond what I have documented in The Battle of France Then & Now.

[B.F.M. Droog]

Hello Peter,

The statement about the massive losses came from F.K. Mason, 'The Westland Lysander', Profile Publications, ca. 1966.

It seems that I have to remove that quote from my 2 Squadron page.

Regards,

Bart

[Bernard]

Good morning,

B.A.F.F SUMMARIES OF OPERATIONS 10th MAY-16th June. 1940
AIR 35/192.
" BACK VIOLET TO 1800 HOURS 4th JUNE 1940 "

On this document wich is the last of this file giving informations about Lysander Squadrons, No 2 Squadron is given the following operationel strengh:

12 Lysander serviceable, 3 unserviceable, 24 crews available.

AIRCRAFT CASUALTIES - B.A.F.F.
AIR 35/196.

Here are the No 2 Squadron losses recorded in this file:

22/05/40. Reg. No. 14607. L6849. Lost.
19/05/40. Reg. No. ?. P.1672. Lost.
22/05/40. Reg. No 14444. Kow. Lost.
01/06/1940. Reg. No. 16694. L4809. Lost.
01/06/1940. Reg. No. 17027. ?. Lost.

Hope this helps.

Best regards.

Bernard.

Once again we should always be very cautious regarding some published works. Let' s get back to the roots !

[B.F.M. Droog]

Hello Bernard,

Thanks! Yet it brings more questions.

For 19/05/1940 neither Peter Cornwell nor I did find losses with 2 Squadron.

On 01/06/1940 2 Squadron lost L4809, crew:
Flying Officer Anthony F. Doidge, RAF 39719, 2 Sqdn., DFC, Mentioned in Despatches, age 24, 01/06/1940, missing
Sergeant Ian R.W. Michelmore, RAF 531479, 2 Sqdn., age 21, 01/06/1940, missing

Could the second 01/06/1940 loss, Reg. No. 17027. ? be this plane?:

Type: Westland Lysander
Serial number: ?, KO-K
Operation: Tactical Reconnaissance
Lost: 31/05/1940
Pilot Officer (Pilot) Clifford H. Dearden, RAF 41677, 2 Sqdn., age 20, 31/05/1940, De Panne Communal Cemetery, B
Leading Aircraftman Arthur O'Neill, RAFVR 903300, 2 Sqdn., age unknown, 31/05/1940, missing
Believed crippled in attack by Uffz Busch of 2./JG20 during observation sortie between Nieuport (Nieuwpoort) and Ostend (Oostende), retired west at low level but shot down by Lt Müncheberg of Stb III./JG26 between Furnes (Veurne) and Dunkirk (Duinkerken/Dunkerque) 14.35 hrs.

And: 12 Lysander serviceable, 3 unserviceable, 24 crews available - on what date?

Regards,

Bart