I./ZG 1 claims in 1939 - 1940 - any info?

[Marius]

What is long after and why your statements are so definite?

On the 5th Sept.:
3./KG 2 shot down Okrzeja at appr. 13.30 hours at Wyszkow. You surely know where his graveyard is (Kregi Stare at Wyszkow).
IV./LG 1 flew a sortie between 12.31-14.10 with escort of I./ZG 1. Kpt.Opulski`s account agrees completely with German records and with the document of Pursuit Brigade. Therefore I accept it as the best of all memories written by Polish pilots about this particular mission. It doesn`t matter that it was published in older Pawlak`s book.
According to IPMS, Lot.AII.11/1d-11 the III dyon had one engagement with the enemy. The document does not differe both engagements, but surely means that only one unit - the 112th eskadra - fought against the enemy (as described in the document).
There is nothing about the 111 eskadra. Sorry for that.

Could you explain the difference between older source (Pawlak 1991) and newer (Cynk 2000)? The latter states that the sections were Okrzeja, Łokuciewski, Nowakowski and Łapkowski, Górecki, Gallus? How about statement of Łaszkiewicz, who noted Okrzeja was hit by own A.A.?

I could write many pages about mistakes and manipulations done by Mr. Cynk. But the fact that in his ignorance he decided to disregard German records completely as some Polish publishers tried to build up an outstanding work (for the first time ever) shows us the way this autor works. The only useful things in his book "Polskie lotnictwo mysliwskie..." are the original Polish documents.

A hit by own A.A. is not a collision, right?

There are also other statements and documents, which should not be disregarded.

Please quote these documents. I hope you will find them.

This is just ridiculous - there are Polish documents that clearly state it was 111 Eskadra which fought against Ju 87s at the very same time.

Please quote these documents. I hope you will find them also.

I cannot find this particular report, but as noted above, corrections were added to several documents and this could be the case.

IPMS, Lot.AII.15/1b-11. You better should find it and not just ignore it.

Who is the many?

For sure Skalski and Rolski. But that`s not the point. At the end you will find Do 17`s, Ju 87`s, Me 109`s and Me 110`s. Maybe you will even find some Me 262`s.

Do I have to repeat ad nauseam that Pniak in his report dated 4.09.1939 clearly states that he fought against twin engined aircraft

Pniak repoprted "two engined aircraft" from a distance of appr. 2 000 meters and before he ever started! He then fought against these aircraft and was credited with a ... Ju 87! So he claimed a two engined Ju 87.
Nonetheless I never heard about sections of 3 attacking Bf 110`s. These only could be sections of Ju 87`s.

No German record is stating about fightings between I./ZG 1 and Polish fighters on this day. Even Prof.Trenel who had masses of German documents during the war wrote about 3 PZL shot down and 2 forced to land. This agrees with survived German records. 3 PZL claims by 1.(J)/LG 2 and 2 force landings claimed by III./StG 2.

One correction for your archive:
Earlier combat 8. and 9./StG 2, later combat 7./StG 2 and I.(J)/LG 2.

Finally, it was you, who excluded possibility of joint Me 109/Me 110 escort, which leads to the clear conclusion.

Joint formations of Me 109/Me 110 did not fly any single mission for one bomber formation (strenght 9 - 30 aircraft) in Poland 1939. I am very sorry that you do not know that.

Marius