Crash place of Otto Kittel found

[knusel]

Good afternoon Gentlemen,

was the Il-2 shot down on Kittel's last combat confirmed as his last (267th) kill or was his 267th one of his earlier claims ?

Michael

[Nick Hector]

Originally Posted by knusel

Good afternoon Gentlemen,

was the Il-2 shot down on Kittel's last combat confirmed as his last (267th) kill or was his 267th one of his earlier claims ?

Michael

Sensible question, sensible answer:

As discussed elsewhere on the forum:
(http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...=24636&page=5; http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=34771)

His last victory was from 806 ShAP, 206 ShAD. It is known to have made an emergency landing. (Kittel was against 190 ShAP and (more likely) 502 ShAP, 214ShAD of 15VA when he was KIA two days later though)

[knusel]

These links do not answer my question.

Was the Il-2 that was brought down on Kittel's last flight part of his official tally of 267 kills or is it a 268th claim that was not confirmed due to the demise of Kittel ?

Michael

[Nick Hector]

Originally Posted by knusel

These links do not answer my question.

Was the Il-2 that was brought down on Kittel's last flight part of his official tally of 267 kills or is it a 268th claim that was not confirmed due to the demise of Kittel ?

Michael

Where does it say he got one on his last flight? Source please....

[Evgeny Velichko]

Nick:
-There is no evidence about Kittle's combats / claims on 14 february. Also, on 14 february 1945 weather was such bad that neither VVS nor Luftwaffe flew combat missions.

-On 16 february 45, Kittel fought against 502 ShAP and was killed. Il-2, that was shot down (by Renner's report), was only damaged, and with wounded gunner, could fly back to airfield and land.

[Nick Hector]

Originally Posted by Evgeny Velichko

Nick:
-There is no evidence about Kittle's combats / claims on 14 february. Also, on 14 february 1945 weather was such bad that neither VVS nor Luftwaffe flew combat missions.

-On 16 february 45, Kittel fought against 502 ShAP and was killed. Il-2, that was shot down (by Renner's report), was only damaged, and with wounded gunner, could fly back to airfield and land.

Cheers Evgeny,

So I wonder why we have a notation for 14 February, of:
806 ShAP, 206 ShAD. Known to have made an emergency landing

Hope your birthday was a good one too by the way

[Leo Etgen]

Hi guys

I think that the confusion arises over the fact that I have seen some statements that he was killed on 14 February 1945 when we now know that this happened on 16 February 1945. I believe that Die Ritterkreuzträger Der Luftwaffe 1939-1945 by Obermaier might be the source of this discrepancy. Apparently, Kittel attacked one of the Il-2 Sturmovik ground-attack aircraft during his last engagement and I believe this to be the last one credited to him (although now we know it was only damaged).

http://www.pilotenbunker.de/Jagdflie...ittel_flug.jpg

Any comments or corrections will be appreciated!

Horrido!

Leo

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Leo Etgen

Hi guys

I think that the confusion arises over the fact that I have seen some statements that he was killed on 14 February 1945 when we now know that this happened on 16 February 1945. I believe that Die Ritterkreuzträger Der Luftwaffe 1939-1945 by Obermaier might be the source of this discrepancy.

Leo

My copy (2nd revised edition) gives 16 February as the date of his death.

[Nick Hector]

Thanks Leo and "other Nick" the whole thing makes so much more sense now that the discrepancy is pointed out and it's good to see that it has been corrected

[Evgeny Velichko]

Originally Posted by Leo Etgen

Hi guys
Apparently, Kittel attacked one of the Il-2 Sturmovik ground-attack aircraft during his last engagement and I believe this to be the last one credited to him (although now we know it was only damaged).

http://www.pilotenbunker.de/Jagdflie...ittel_flug.jpg

Any comments or corrections will be appreciated!

Leo, I suggest to read my article carefully, especially last part. His last combat mission is well covered in BOTH german and soviet reports and documents, and BOTH side documents fith each other almost 100%! Fight and crashplace, altitude, number of Fw190's, number of Il-2's e.t.c.