Strange case of Walter Dahl

[Stig Jarlevik]

Hi Johannes

I have the first edition of Obermaier (1966), and he states there:
Total of 723 missions, including 187 fighter-bomber sorties, 143 victories (17 West, 4 four-engined).

I never knew Obermaier, so I cannot say if this is his own invention or not, but somehow he does not come across as a fantasy writer. I know he must have been a friend of Karl Ries, since they did at least one book together. If they also were friends of Hans Ring, is something I don't know, but together they sort of formed an early triangle of German historians back in the 1960s.

We also have to remember that during the 1960s to basically early 1990s everyone simply believed that all data coming from Germany was correct and no one really questioned their value. With more and more data coming from the other side in the East combined with deep research in remaining German files a different picture started to appear which also kept increasing.

I suppose that is where we stand now.

So was Obermaier the "inventor" or was he in turn "tricked" by someone else? No idea....

Cheers
Stig

[knusel]

Good morning,

sometimes scores were faked posthumously by friends or relatives of the deceased (e.g. Mannock, Nishizawa...)

Cheers,

Michael

[Johannes]

Hi Guys

I agree Stig, probably Obermaier was mislead by somebody, but guess we will never know. Facts are then that the 143 has been in play from 1966 or before. It's also likely that Tanzer knew nothing of this. I would be surprised if Woidich knew of his 110 as he sent my friend Bernd Barbas his abschusselist which only contained eighty-two. Trouble is that we this that this is their life, for most of the survivors it was just a small piece that many would like to forget, don't suppose that Woidich bought publications to read about himself, so likely as I said he just didn't know, and likely Tanzer in the same position, and his early death didn't help him find out either, perhaps the 143 was even invented/miss-quoted between 1960(his death) and the 1966 Obermaier publication.

With what Michael said I think of Friedrich Wachowiak, here Obermaier credits him with eight-six minimum, but his Mother says 120, his comrades 140. Yet after a long combat free break he returns to take his total to exactly eighty-nine...…...again Obermaier is honest about hearsay, same with Ulrich Wohnert.

When I first started seriously compiling Luftwaffe data/totals I would use a sheet of paper and in the first line number what has previously been quoted, so take Erwin Lastowski using Obermaier's book I would have written forty-six numbers in column one, and noted the fronts in the last column i.e first twenty-five Russian, last twenty-one Allied, fourteen viermots, yet his total is only fifteen, ten Russian, five American viermots, Like Tanzer you wonder for what his Ritterkreuz was awarded, though with all fairness he did claim many other viermots that just not confirmed, as he himself mentioned they were unconfirmed they must have been H.S.S or E.V, yet he again doen't mention this either, I suspect Obermaier is confusing the points system in the West with "victories", but that doesn't explain the discrepancy with the Russian claims.

I still think there is information out there to influence how we credit obscure pilots like Tanzer's totals. History is a strange thing, we learn more about the truth the further from the actual time of the events we get.

Kind Regards

Johannes

[knusel]

Good morning Johannes,

yes, that's a wise choice of words.

Today is my last working day for 2018.
Thanks a lot for your praiseworthy historical research work.
I'm looking forward to read anything you will find out in the future.

I wish you and your family a happy Xmas time and a successful new year 2019 !

Michael

[Johannes]

Hi Michael

Many thanks, and the same to you.

Kind Regards

Johannes

[knusel]

Good evening Johannes,

for Xmas I received Lance Bronnenkant's BLUE MAX AIRMEN Vol12. Surprisingly and in contrast to the other German WW1 aces Eduard von Schleich has an extremely poor correlation of his claims with Allied losses. As his squadronmates do no come off much better, the author discusses if this is due to some kind of conspiracy by them or due to the possibility that the Allied loss records for this period and this part of the front having been lost.
Did you receive an airwar book for Xmas ?

Have some good final days of 2018,

Michael

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by knusel

Good evening Johannes,

for Xmas I received Lance Bronnenkant's BLUE MAX AIRMEN Vol12. … Did you receive an airwar book for Xmas ?
Michael

Getting well off topic there, I think: better discussed in a new thread under "Books" or in a PM.