Photos 3-9

[Richey4Real]

those of us who have a liking for other broekn eagles might want to take a look at some of the other pics the guy with the R4M 190 is selling,some nice 109 wrecks.

Nick

http://search.ebay.de/_W0QQfrtsZ450Q...msdivision1944

[F19Gladiator]

Originally Posted by Richey4Real

those of us who have a liking for other broekn eagles might want to take a look at some of the other pics the guy with the R4M 190 is selling,some nice 109 wrecks.

Nick

http://search.ebay.de/_W0QQfrtsZ450Q...msdivision1944

Thanks for the tip! This "White 1" seems to be the same ac as the one published on page 76, top and bottom, in Kagero Bf 109 G/K Vol.III. This web photo shows the ac seen from the port side this time.
Unfortunately no info on location. Captioned as being a G-6.

http://cgi.ebay.de/WWII-German-AIRPL...QQcmdZViewItem

[Kari Lumppio]

Hello!

The He 59 in this photo:
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=270097501259

is probably PY+NF. Three Finnish official military photos of the He 59 PY+NF are in the Finnish archives. Those photos are captioned "A German plane forced down by AA at Lauttasaari island beach" Lauttasaari is almost downtown Helsinki. Time is Summer 1941.

EDIT In book "German aircraft in Finland" by Keskinen et al at page 120 there is photo of He 59 B-1 PY+NF WNr 1821 (it is one of the "SA-kuva" photos I mentioned). The place is Helsinki Lauttasaari.

Cheers,
Kari

[F19Gladiator]

Regarding the Fw 190 D again, which I find a most interesting find:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=140094528295

I do not have all the references handy listed on the website by David E. Brown on this thread as they are in my other home seven time zones away, but when comparing with photos of other Ds found in the Bad Wörishofen area listed as D-11s of the 220xxx series; Double Chevron; ; "Double Chevron dash"; Chevron 57 and Chevron 61 - This 190 shows a strong resemblance with these. Another D-11 found now?
Regarding the number "57": Given the number of 190Ds opertaional in the unit (Strenght report existing?) I find it remarcable that two ac individuals both carried the tactical number 57, even if one might have been without chevron, during the same time period. (Replacing the bellied in < 57 ???)

By the way, waiting eagerly for Fw 190 D Part 2 from Eric Larger and team - 30 years ago I did not even dare to hope that so much info on the late Doras would surface! Absolut top quality work!

Ref:
Fw 190D Camouflage & Markings P.1, Eric Larger et al., Po.
Fw 190 "Long Nose", Dietmar Hermann, Schiffer.

[Eric Larger]

Hello all of you

for the moment this picture suggests more new questions than real answers .

For me photo in Experten decals #2 and this one on ebay are depicting the same machine, same, trees in the back ground , etc ...

I think that both photos were taken at Bad Wörishofen , were all other known FW 190D-11s have been found .

There are similaries between this machine on ebay and Fw 190D-11 W.Nr 220011 , there are several more photos of this particuliar aircraft exising , but none of them enables us to see if underwing rockets racks were installed . So until it will be possible to see the Werknummer , we cannot be 100% sure .

Eric

[David E. Brown]

Hi Eric,

I believe that you are correct in your thoughts that the R4M-träger in our book and the aircraft in this new photo are the same aircraft.

I came to this conclusion after spending some time comparing the various images of this aircraft. The photo of it on its belly must have been taken at a later date when it was being salvaged, but enough of it is visible to copare it with the one in our book.

Regarding the markings, photos of "we.<61" show an interesting feature. On the port side of the aircraft, the code is displayed as "<61". Yet on the starboard side it is the mirror image "61>". The number "57" is of the same style and size in all the images. Given the above observation, the new D-11 photograph in all probability had the code "57>" on the starboard side but can't be seen in this image.

I believe that there are enough comperable features in the photos of this aircraft to conclude that it was not an Fw 190 D-9 attached to I./JG 301 and Dave Wadman and I originally interpreted, but a rare Fw 190 D-11, WNr.220011, "we.<57" of the Verbandführeschule General der Jagdflieger.

A significant question remains: What was this unit doing with aircraft equipped with this weapon? There are some obvious possible explanations but certainly more reseach is needed.

All the best with the book!

Cheers,

David

[F19Gladiator]

Looking closely at the Fw 190 D "White 57" image when enlarged, I notice there is a bright mark just ahead of the number "57", almost covered by the trailing edge of the wing. Positioned ahead of the rectangular patch placed mid-level of the "7", the angle and position corresponding what could be the lower end of a chevron. Place and angle could (perhaps) indicate the possibility of the ac carrying a white chevron ahead of the number "57"?
Given the heavy exhaust staining from the engine, the lower end of the chevron ought to be stained, which according to my image interpretation might be the case. Perhaps a closer look at an enlargment of the original can tell.

Only my vivid imagination, or can someone else see something similar???

Any way, I would be very surprised if this would turn out NOT to be the D-11 WNr.220011.

[focusfocus]

MODELDAD
directive of the luftwaffe has to leave of november 1942:all the plane glancing through the ex-zone free,have to concern wings and fuselage of the white bands(strips) understood included.
there are photos of fw.190 of II/JG.2 in tranzit for tunisia with bands.