Photos 3-24 - Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum

edwest · #1 25th March 2007, 06:24

edwest · #2 25th March 2007, 06:59

Misc.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=330102562942

Very large photo group
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=140098746002

Photo album
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=140100398523
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=140100402815

Usual disclaimer,
Ed

F19Gladiator · #3 25th March 2007, 13:20

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=330102367875

Tiger emblem of 4./JG 26 under cockpit. Aircraft camouflage looks very similar to "White 4 + -" of 4./JG 26 which was bellied in by Horst Perez in Sussex on 30 September 1940, also featuring the same emblem.

F19Gladiator · #4 25th March 2007, 13:25

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=110106095052

A very similar photo of this Il-2 was sold earlier. Only position of soldiers diff.

Bertrand H · #5 25th March 2007, 13:59

Hi,

You are right « Gladiator », a similar print published page 212 of Die Jagdfliegerverbande der Deutschen Luftwaffe 1934-1945, teil 3

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=330102367875

Bertrand H

pstrany · #6 25th March 2007, 18:55

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=250097236628

Hey, is that mustachioed gentleman by the tail who I think it is? Must have been there to witness his handiwork first-hand......

maccullagh · #7 26th March 2007, 00:56

Hi,

The plane shown in http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...m=250097415397 has similar markings to a 109 I am interested in.

Can anyone supply details of the unit, version of plane, location and timeline please.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Rick

F19Gladiator · #8 26th March 2007, 16:28

I believe it is an F-4 "Yellow 4" of 6./JG53. Info at eBay says "Italy" why it might be from 1942 while stationed at Comiso, Sicily for example.
I do not have my best references at hand now, but I am sure some JG53 knowledgeble member can give more exact info.
I believe II/JG53 took part in the offensive over Malta in the spring of 1942 and stayed in Siciily over the summer.

maccullagh · #9 27th March 2007, 00:26

Thanks F19gladiator,

I have a photo of my father standing beside a 109 identified as an F series at El Adem airfield, North Africa that is dated Christmas 1941. This plane had been shot down sometime before that.

My father was back in Australia by April 1942 and was dressed for cold weather which would comfirm the timing.

A number of members of this forum have commented that these particular markings would not have been in this location until say mid 1942 and onwards which is the mystery.

Although my father is standing in front of the markings on the starboard side I am confident that they are the same markings as in the above photo except it is Yellow 9.

As the unit you mention above was in the same geograhic part of the world, could this plane have come from the same unit.

If a Yellow 9 existed in the unit you mention does anyone have some information regarding it.

Thanks

Rick

F19Gladiator · #10 28th March 2007, 16:05

Hello Rick,
I find your photo question interesting why I post a few more lines on the subject.

15.12.1941 – 7.11.1942 was the period II/JG53 was based at Comiso, Sicily, according to Michael Holms website. http://www.ww2.dk/air/jagd/jg53.htm

I have however found no info that II/JG53 was involved in the action in Libya/Cyrenaica towards the end of 1941, the unit being instead active in the operations over Malta.

Does the photo you have show the JG53 “Pik As” emblem?
If not, it might be a 109 F-4 from 6./JG 27 of II/JG27 which was involved in the fighting in this area (Cyrenaica). If the aircraft was found at El Adem south of Tobruk by Christmas 1941, it was soon after Tobruk was retaken (Dec 1941) by the 8:th Army, following Operation Crusader.
It might be of interest to consider the information in “Jagdgeschwader 27” by Ring and Girbig, P.247. that in what must have been mid to end of November 1941, the II/JG27 had 30 F-4 and G-2, whereof six were received fresh from Germany. It is not unlikely that such fresh aircraft maintained the European camouflage scheme and colours while completely repainting aircraft hardly was the first priority, if even possible.

It is of course theoretically possible that aircraft had been transferred from JG 53 in Sicily to replace losses during the intensive fighting around Tobruk and this/these aircraft being flown in the livery they arrived in. I have so far not found any information pointing in that direction though.

Another photo of a JG 53 Bf109 F-4/Z “Yellow 12” of 6./JG 53 is published in “Messerschmitt Bf 109 F, G & K Series” by Prien and Rodeike, Schiffer, P.29. Here captioned as being taken at “Comiso airfield in early 1942” and indicating it had a green/gray scheme.
Also a F-4/Z “Yellow 9” on p.30 of 6./JG 53 from Comiso “early 1942”.

Again, are you sure the photo shows a JG 53 aircraft?????????

II/JG 53 did participate in N. Africa but that was almost one year later, from November 1942, and in Tunisia. By then they were operating Bf 109 G.

I do unfortunately not have my most detailed JG 53 references at where I am now, why I find it difficult to dig deeper here and now.

I hope some JG 53 "Experten" can help you further. If not solved I will check out more when I get hold of the rest of my ref. mtrl.

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