19 Squadron on 29th August 1941

[Adriano Baumgartner]

On that date, 19 Squadron launched eleven Spitfires Mark II to patrold the Dutch Islands and North Sea. They clashed with a formation of Bf 110 from II/ZG 76. I would like to obtain some help to clarify the following questions:
1- The original formation was 11 Spitfires or 12? If 12, one of them returned early? Who? In which aircraft serial number?
2- There is a mention to the death of a certain Sergeant ____Davies. Does somebody know his surname, or RAF number service? It seems he was flying the Spitfire IIa with serial P8255.
3- Only three more Spitfires were lost:
Cat.3m 29.08.41 P/O P.D.G. Stuart: kia 12 Group 19 Sqn. Spitfire IIa: QV - Me 110s off Goeree Island
Cat.3m 29.08.41 P/O P.H. Edmonds: kia 12 Group 19 Sqn. Spitfire IIa: QV - Me 110s off Goeree Island
Cat.3m 29.08.41 Sgt. G.J. Parkin: kia 12 Group 19 Sqn. Spitfire IIa: QV - Me 110s off Goeree Island
Cat.3m 29.08.41 Sgt. Davies: kia 12 Group 19 Sqn. Spitfire IIa P8255 Me 110s off Goeree Island
Someone have the serial number of the first three?
Thanks a lot for all help.
Adriano

[Alex Smart]

Hi Adriano,

From Norman Franks Fighter Comand Losses vols 1 & 2.
Stuart = P8243; Edmonds = P8668. This was an ASR search for S/Ldr Lawson lost the previous evening in P7995. F/Lt. W. Cunningham was also lost then in P8439, he became a pow. So it is now only Parkins a/c serial that is still unknown.
Alex

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Thanks for helping Alex!
Very nice to find out the serial of the other a/c. You says F/L W Cunningham was lost also on 29th August or alongside S/L Lawson?
By the way, do you know WHO was leading this ASR mission?
Thanks again for your valuable help...
Adriano

[JohnE]

Sgt Clifford Davies (1106853).

/John E

[Alex Smart]

Hi Adriano,
Cunningham and Lawson were lost the previous evening.
Alex

[Fairlop]

Several of nice photographs of F/L Cunningham´s Spitfire LR IIA, P8439, QV-X was on E-bay action this summer.

Michal

[rob van den nieuwendijk]

Hello all,

Sgt Davies was not KIA, but taken POW.

Best regards
Rob

[Hans Nauta]

Hello Adriano and Alex,

Some other things to add:
The Fighter Command Losses by Norman L R. Franks only list Sgt Davies' Spitfire: P8255

And I've filed the other pilots and serials as:
P/O Stuart: P8868
P/O Edmunds: P8449
Sgt Parker: P8243

My listing is different from that of Alex, but I've failed to file the source however...

One of the Bf.110's involved in the combat was damaged. Wnr 2430 M8+KP made a belly landing at De Kooy airfield at 11.15 hrs with damaged rudders and elevators. Gefr Alfred Bunke was wounded. Damage to the Bf.110E-2 was 30%.

Perhaps anybody has the name of the pilot of this Bf.110 on file?

Best regards,
Hans Nauta

[Alex Smart]

Hello Hans,

Some other things to add:
The Fighter Command Losses by Norman L R. Franks only list Sgt Davies' Spitfire: P8255

In my first responce I made reference to both FCL Volume 1 and 2.
Volume 1
Page 139 has only Sgt Davies a/c serial number , given as Spitfire IIa P8255.
Volume 2
Page 155 in "Amendments & Additions to Volume 1" has P/O P D G Stuart was flying Spitfire IIa P8243 and P/O P H Edmonds was flying P8668.

Air Britain P1000 - R9999 has your P8868 as an Airspeed Oxford and P8449 as being lost with 91 Sqn.

FCL Vol 1 has Parkin not Parker.

All the best
Alex

[Adriano Baumgartner]

Ran, Alex, John and Fairlop,
Thank you all for the information I was seeking. I still do not know how the combat developed, but 19 Squadron suffered in two days a huge loss of experienced men!
I was particularly interested on the activities of Lt. Martin Drewes, of .6/ZG 76, who claimed a Spitfire that day. The Zerstorers must have surprised part of the 11 Spitfires on the ASR patrol. ( If I were the Spitfire leader I would have split my forces: one covering high up, the other searching down low. I imagine that this small force which should have been searching must have been surprised by the incoming Zerstorers, who after the first pass must have formed their defensive circle...but this is only guessing - I do not have the ORB´s to check it out...)
Thanks to both of you...I will keep searching to find out more about this action. I think Drewes was flying M8+DM ( had to check it out on his book ).
Yours
Adriano