jet aircraft in Italy?

[George Hopp]

A Ju 88S with GM-1, and FuG 217 tail-warning radar?

[Nick Beale]

Close!

On the strength returns for Italy on 1 March 1945 you have a choice of the Ju 88 T-3 or Ju 188 D-2 on strength with 4.(F)/122.

[maxjvb]

my witness was shure to saw a Me 262 in the late days of war at Orio al Serio airport Bergamo.

[veltro]

Sorry, but no Me 262 did ever operate or flew in Italy, as evidenced in the postings of this thread and by the results of many years of researches.

The personal experience acquired through all this time, taught me to be extremely vary of "eyewitnesses" which claimed sightings of all kinds, most of those with hindsight reached through informations and inputs often gained only after the war, a sort of "layered" memory.

Even ANR pilots themselves did seem to remember "Me 262s" which in all cases proved to be either one of the three Ar 234s briefly based in Campoformido since late February 1945.

As already said, the only two airfields used by the Ar 234 (or by jets) were Lonate Pozzolo and Campoformido (not to mention a short stay in Osoppo of one Arado which required RATO rockets assistance to take-off) and each of their flights was duly reported, and also, due to the the very tiny quantities allotted of their special fuel, those were carefully placed only in the bases they used, and Orio al Serio wasn't among the recipients.

Last but not least, due to the very classified knowledge and use of the German jets, their movements were duly tracked and reported on documents both by the Germans and by their enemy, the Allies. The absence of any trace of such presence is a further evidence, IMHO.

[Nick Beale]

I'd just add my growing impression that to people in 1944-45, "all jets looked the same", perhaps because it was the absence of propellers that made the greatest impression on anyone who saw one of these aircraft, not the details of their shapes. I can think of at least two pilots who shot down an Ar 234 but claimed an Me 262 for.

Also, we tend to think of a bomber as being much bigger than a fighter but the Me 262 and Ar 234 were not so far apart in size (or so I thought when I built models of them when I was a boy!).

[maxjvb]

my eyewitness is a 84 age civil pilot that lived on the edge around the Airfield, entusiast in fling since ever. He confirmed me that was a ME 262 and not Arado ( he well know the planes), infact he think this plane was sent to Orio al Serio just for a Propaganda fly to give a hope to all Lufwaffe personnel in the base. The plane stayed at orio just a day.

[veltro]

Though absolutely respecting you and your source, such kind of unconfirmed (and most probably never confirmable) individual eyewitness account from memory, contrasting with all documented sources (and also, with all due respect, contrasting with plain logic and opportunity at that time of war and on Italian theatre), IMHO is unfortunately destined to remain just as it is, an unconfirmed memory.