RLM colours please.

[amiers]

anothe 2 hours of searching and it seems it may be 70/79

[obdl3945]

Hi, Amiers...

Well, I'd certainly be able to accept that combination, especially as a sandgelb colour, perhaps RML79 or something approaching an approximation, was used on JG54's Fw190s. Aircraft operating out over the vast expanses of the Soviet Union used this type of colour quite frequently over the dryer, dustier earth-coloured ground, and oftentimes had dust filters fitted to them as well.

So, two hours, eh...? I've been at this for 37 years and I'm still asking questions... . I hope you've enjoyed the hunt, though. I can think of worse ways to spend a Sunday afternoon.

I've put a link below for you. Perhaps you're researching a colour scheme for a model, I don't know, but if you scroll down to 'Messerschmitt' and pick out the 'F' version, you'll get a really good idea of some of the colours. There's also a JG3 Bf109F in a sand, grey and green non-standard 'splinter' scheme which I particularly like, and is a lovely example of the unorthodox.

Kindest regards...

http://www.hyperscale.com/features.htm

[amiers]

yes i found that one. thats what made me look harder.but i found this also.

[Evgeny Velichko]

Just 3 cents, gents.

1. Soviet VVS HAD NO BROUN colour in theyr camouflage at all. AMT-1 was sand/gray (NOT broun), but it got used only from october 1943.

2. JG 54's Bf109 and Fw190 used RLM79 mixed with RLM02 for theyr "Broun" colour. "Green" were RLM 70 (used with Bf109), RLM 71 (used together with RLM 70 in Fw190) and RLM 25 (Used by II./JG 54's Fw190 in 1943).

3. "Soviet paint", used by JG 54, is very ald myth, based on speculation.

4. The same situation with Fw190 of JG 51. They used the same mixture for theyr "Broun".

[Christian Schulz]

Actually Claes Sundin made profiles for "Black Cross - Red Star" Vol 3 which had JG 54 aircraft showing both RLM 70 and AMT-4 (i.e. Nowotny's Bf 109 F).

[obdl3945]

Hi, Evgeny...

Thanks for your information, it certainly explains a lot.


Amiers...

Very good, I'm very impressed... Now we all better understand the confusion that can arise. So, my friend, which one do you believe...? Or do you think that perhaps they are both valid schemes, applied at slightly different time periods...? Ah, the trials, tribulations and endless hours of fun we all get from researching the Luftwaffe...

Regards...

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by amiers

i have found that the lighter colour is RLM 83. i think the other might be 81 or 82?

Those colours were not issued until later in the war, too late for the Bf 109 F in front line service.

[Evgeny Velichko]

Originally Posted by Christian Schulz

Actually Claes Sundin made profiles for "Black Cross - Red Star" Vol 3 which had JG 54 aircraft showing both RLM 70 and AMT-4 (i.e. Nowotny's Bf 109 F).

Usure of AMT-1, AMt-4 in Liftwaffe is speculation only.

1. Germans didnt accept Soviet colours because of its quality. German aviation paint were matt, but Soviet - a bit glossing, and in flight it shined on sun and demasking.

2. Also, hundreds of aircrafts (both German and Finnish) were painted in new color. You may just calculate how much paint Germans had to "capture" to paint theyr aircrafts

[Franek Grabowski]

I do not think RLM 79 was used at all. I believe there were two distinguished camouflages, one following Finnish pattern with their colours, and another using RLM 70, 71 and 02 colours. I believe that tannish colour of 02 on known colour photos is due to light of sun low over horizon.

[amiers]

Originally Posted by obdl3945

Hi, Evgeny...

Thanks for your information, it certainly explains a lot.


Amiers...

Very good, I'm very impressed... Now we all better understand the confusion that can arise. So, my friend, which one do you believe...? Or do you think that perhaps they are both valid schemes, applied at slightly different time periods...? Ah, the trials, tribulations and endless hours of fun we all get from researching the Luftwaffe...

Regards...

well its a hard call. i must admit i had forgotton that 81,82,83 were not introduced till 44, so that rules them out. the info i found was here www.pegatiros.com/.../luftwave/index.htm i translated the page into english. i have also discovered that the RLM may have re-released colours late in the war with different numbers. 61/62=81/82 i have all these colours and did a test spray, they are very similar.

so i have no doubt the camo pattern was green, but the base colour is going to be hard. some decal sheets show it in what appears to be 83 but i cant find any reference to that, so where did they get it?

stay tuned to this channel!


p.s what colour is the green on this G10 82 or 83 or what should it be?. this seems to be a popular 109 for modelers