Bf 109K Data Plate Location

[stephen f. polyak]

Great photo! I suspect it's a plate. Both position (for a 109) and size are appropriate. As for the standout lighter color, some later-war 109 G series plates (I've two) were simply pieces of rough-cut aluminum sheet with rather crude hand-stamped entries. Those plates were not etched to begin with or painted after stamping/installation. Think of shiny aluminum. Maybe that's what's seen on this K. Hopefully, in time, more photos will surface and the debate will be resolved. Of course, my dream is that one of those GIs pulled the "plate" and that it will surface again.

[RolandF]

This reminds me of a Bf 109K-4 captioned on p.153 of "Captured 109s" as having been found at Grafenwöhr (Vilseck?). Same dark camouflage without distinguishable colour shades, and no recognizable bulges on the left fuselage side. Very sharp swastika with glossy surface - seems to be a "Abziehbild" (decal).

Regards

Roland

[bavgan]

Hello,
I actually did not pay attention to its being an Erla built K-4. I am glad that you liked it.

Mike,

Thats the reason I posted the photo. I can not say anything for the glare, but dont you think its position is too low for the data plate?

Batur

[S Sheflin]

RolandF,

I am not certain, but I believe that the darkly colored Bf 109 to which you are referring is the same one I published in color in AIRFOIL #1. Its location, as noted on the sourced USAF color movie, was Frankfurt-Rhein Main. Apparently an Erla-built G-10, this unmarked aircraft featured the square refined cowling return, large wing bumps, a short tail wheel leg, and a Werknummer across its wooden fin and rudder in what I have designated, “Position 3.”

Regarding the shiny metal rectangle below this new K-4’s cockpit, I have documented the positions of Bf 109 factory ID tags in my database, and this one fits in nicely with the vast majority produced by Erla.

Steve Sheflin

[stephen f. polyak]

It's not necessarily too low. In fact, main plates fitted to some 109Es and earlier types were positioned even lower (and also further forward). I doubt pilots and crew even noticed these plates. (Allied soldiers were another matter!) Their location was of no particular consequence. As mentioned above, various positions related to maker and production type/series were used. Now, taking the guessing game further . . . what if main plates on 109Ks were typically over-painted? This would perhaps explain why these plates do not "jump out" of period photos. And going further, what if the plate in this picture was already removed? What would appear there, but lighter, unpainted/primed fuselage skinning. Given the propensity of GIs for souvenir gathering (and the size and apparent leisure of this group), such a grab is not beyond possible. We certainly know that many plates landed in the pockets of the victors.

[RolandF]

Steve,

it was this one - http://www.kecay.com/images/Atelier%...y/Me109/17.jpg - I was referring to. This photo in original is in colour? Most interesting.

Regards

Roland

[stephen f. polyak]

Is it possible to establish that it's the same plane in both photos (W.Nr.)? If it's not the same plane, then it appears to be an identical twin. From what I can see, the photo in the profile book does not reveal a data plate (overpainted or just not there?).

[S Sheflin]

Hello all,

I am certain these are one in the same. Both 109’s have the same components: large wheel bumps, short tail wheel, no markings, and dark camouflage. However, the clincher is the same pillbox is present on the beam in the background and the main wheels are close to the shallow drainage ditch.

Steve Sheflin

[stephen f. polyak]

Allowing that it is the same plane, the mystery rectangle either came or went between photos. Judging by the landscape, seems the bird itself moved too.

[S Sheflin]

First a correction. My previous posting should read, “the same pillbox is present on the berm in the background.”

Stephen, you are correct. On my color photo of this Bf 109 G-10, the small silvery rectangle visible on Mr. Searl’s B&W view (at the upper corner of the square refined cowling return) cannot be seen. I believe this a function of the angle and the darkness of my color slide, or maybe a GI took the plate? There are too many matching points in the photos for them not to be the same aircraft.

Steve Sheflin