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  #1  
Old 30th January 2016, 22:33
Old Charly Old Charly is offline
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Hello,

I'm interested to know your conclusions two years and half after the excavations. Have you found new evidence that it was Kittel's Focke Wulf ?

Thank you.

O.C.
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  #2  
Old 17th March 2017, 11:10
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Evgeny Velichko Evgeny Velichko is offline
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Gentlemen, looking into Soviet documents, I must say that Otto Kittel was shot down in combat with 4 (not 14 !) Il-2 of 502 shap, 214shad of 15VA, flown by lt. V.P.Komendat.
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A...B2%D0%B8%D1%87
For this aircombat, he was awarded with Order of Alexander Nevsky.
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  #3  
Old 19th July 2017, 02:51
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Gentlemen:

Renner's report give us two locations:

- 6 km SE Djukste
- 25 ost 37187, wich is SW Djukste.

Is it known, what location is correct?
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  #4  
Old 15th October 2017, 21:53
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Otto Kittel article.

http://warspot.ru/10237-tma-opustila...andskim-kotlom

It was seriously cutted, because was too large for WarSpot format.
But still is a huge.

For all who are interested, I have a full variant.
During research, I found, that of all Kittel's victories, that I looked in, 95% of them are confirmed by soviet loss records.
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  #5  
Old 16th October 2017, 00:37
Dan History Dan History is offline
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evgeny Velichko View Post
Otto Kittel article.
An amazing piece of work, Evgeny, deserving of a separate thread at the least! May I ask how you went about locating the sources that you used to write this article? I will write another reply once I have read your piece thoroughly.

I have sent you a private message.

Regards,

Dan
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Old 16th October 2017, 02:09
PMoz99 PMoz99 is offline
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Excellent article Evgeny! Thank you for sharing. I would like very much to see the full version.....
Thanks
Peter
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Old 18th November 2017, 20:38
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Good afternoon Gentlemen,

was the Il-2 shot down on Kittel's last combat confirmed as his last (267th) kill or was his 267th one of his earlier claims ?

Michael
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Old 18th November 2017, 22:20
Nick Hector Nick Hector is offline
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Quote:
Originally Posted by knusel View Post
Good afternoon Gentlemen,

was the Il-2 shot down on Kittel's last combat confirmed as his last (267th) kill or was his 267th one of his earlier claims ?

Michael
Sensible question, sensible answer:

As discussed elsewhere on the forum:
(http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...=24636&page=5; http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=34771)

His last victory was from 806 ShAP, 206 ShAD. It is known to have made an emergency landing. (Kittel was against 190 ShAP and (more likely) 502 ShAP, 214ShAD of 15VA when he was KIA two days later though)
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Old 20th November 2017, 19:15
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Knusel: I have all of his 264 known victories.
I am not aware about any unconfirmed victories. Even if they are exist, they are still unconfirmed.

Last of Kittel's known victories is on 19.11.1944. After that, he went to recieve Schwerten and for a month furlough. It is believed he came back to front in late january or early february. I believe, due to general fuel shortage and extremly bad weather in Kurland in first half of february, he didnt flew much combat missions.
He was killed on 16 february, and last his 3 victories he might claim during his last two-three weeks in january-february 1945.
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Old 20th November 2017, 19:46
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Re: Crash place of Otto Kittel found
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evgeny Velichko View Post
Knusel: I have all of his 264 known victories.
I am not aware about any unconfirmed victories. Even if they are exist, they are still unconfirmed.

Last of Kittel's known victories is on 19.11.1944. After that, he went to recieve Schwerten and for a month furlough. It is believed he came back to front in late january or early february. I believe, due to general fuel shortage and extremly bad weather in Kurland in first half of february, he didnt flew much combat missions.
He was killed on 16 february, and last his 3 victories he might claim during his last two-three weeks in january-february 1945.
Good evening Evgeny,

I have gathered the following 265 confirmed claims:

# 1 24.06.1941 SB-2
# 2 24.06.1941 SB-2
# 3 06.07.1941 SB-2
# 4 18.08.1941 MiG-1
# 5 19.08.1941 DB-3
# 6 24.08.1941 DB-3
# 7 08.09.1941 R-5
# 8 08.09.1941 I-153
# 9 12.09.1941 I-153
# 10 21.09.1941 MiG-1
# 11 13.10.1941 MiG-1
# 12 13.12.1941 DB-3
# 13 27.02.1942 I-16
# 14 20.03.1942 P-40
# 15 20.03.1942 P-40
# 16 14.05.1942 SB-2
# 17 14.05.1942 SB-2
# 18 23.08.1942 Il-2
# 19 07.09.1942 Il-2
# 20 23.09.1942 I-16
# 21 22.10.1942 Il-2
# 22 12.01.1943 Yak-1
# 23 12.01.1943 Il-2
# 24 12.01.1943 U-2
# 25 12.01.1943 Il-2
# 26 12.01.1943 I-153
# 27 12.01.1943 Il-2
# 28 14.01.1943 La-5
# 29 16.01.1943 Il-2
# 30 24.01.1943 La-5
# 31 26.01.1943 Il-2
# 32 11.02.1943 Il-2
# 33 14.02.1943 Il-2
# 34 14.02.1943 Il-2
# 35 15.02.1943 Il-2
# 36 19.02.1943 LaGG-3
# 37 19.02.1943 La-5
# 38 19.02.1943 Yak-7
# 39 19.02.1943 Pe-2
# 40 21.02.1943 I-16
# 41 07.03.1943 LaGG-3
# 42 07.03.1943 LaGG-3
# 43 10.03.1943 LaGG-3
# 44 10.03.1943 MiG-3
# 45 14.03.1943 LaGG-3
# 46 14.03.1943 LaGG-3
# 47 15.03.1943 MiG-3
# 48 01.04.1943 Il-2
# 49 01.04.1943 Il-2
# 50 11.06.1943 La-5
# 51 18.06.1943 P-40
# 52 22.06.1943 Il-2
# 53 22.06.1943 LaGG-3
# 54 24.06.1943 P-40
# 55 24.06.1943 P-40
# 56 05.07.1943 La-5
# 57 05.07.1943 LaGG-3
# 58 05.07.1943 Il-2
# 59 05.07.1943 Il-2
# 60 07.07.1943 P-40
# 61 07.07.1943 P-39
# 62 07.07.1943 P-40
# 63 09.07.1943 Il-2
# 64 09.07.1943 Il-2
# 65 10.07.1943 LaGG-3
# 66 10.07.1943 LaGG-3
# 67 13.07.1943 Il-2
# 68 13.07.1943 Il-2
# 69 13.07.1943 Il-2
# 70 13.07.1943 Il-2
# 71 16.07.1943 La-5
# 72 16.07.1943 La-5
# 73 16.07.1943 La-5
# 74 17.07.1943 La-5
# 75 17.07.1943 Yak-9
# 76 20.07.1943 LaGG-3
# 77 20.07.1943 Yak-9
# 78 27.07.1943 Il-2
# 79 28.07.1943 Il-2
# 80 28.07.1943 Il-2
# 81 01.08.1943 Yak-9
# 82 02.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 83 02.08.1943 La-5
# 84 02.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 85 03.08.1943 P-39
# 86 03.08.1943 La-5
# 87 04.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 88 04.08.1943 Il-2
# 89 04.08.1943 Il-2
# 90 04.08.1943 Il-2
# 91 04.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 92 04.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 93 04.08.1943 La-5
# 94 05.08.1943 LaGG-3
# 95 07.09.1943 LaGG-3
# 96 07.09.1943 Yak-9
# 97 10.09.1943 P-40
# 98 11.09.1943 LaGG-3
# 99 12.09.1943 LaGG-3
# 100 14.09.1943 Yak-9
# 101 14.09.1943 La-5
# 102 14.09.1943 LaGG-3
# 103 15.09.1943 Il-2
# 104 15.09.1943 Il-2
# 105 30.09.1943 Il-2
# 106 05.10.1943 Yak-9
# 107 05.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 108 11.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 109 12.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 110 12.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 111 12.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 112 13.10.1943 R-5
# 113 14.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 114 14.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 115 15.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 116 15.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 117 15.10.1943 Il-2
# 118 15.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 119 17.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 120 19.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 121 22.10.1943 La-5
# 122 23.10.1943 La-5
# 123 28.10.1943 LaGG-3
# 124 05.11.1943 Il-2
# 125 05.11.1943 Il-2
# 126 05.11.1943 LaGG-3
# 127 06.11.1943 Il-2
# 128 05.03.1944 La-5
# 129 06.03.1944 La-5
# 130 07.03.1944 Il-2
# 131 07.03.1944 Yak-1
# 132 08.03.1944 La-5
# 133 08.03.1944 La-5
# 134 19.03.1944 Yak-1
# 135 19.03.1944 Yak-9
# 136 26.03.1944 R-5
# 137 26.03.1944 R-5
# 138 26.03.1944 Yak-9
# 139 28.03.1944 Yak-9
# 140 30.03.1944 Pe-2
# 141 30.03.1944 La-5
# 142 30.03.1944 La-5
# 143 01.04.1944 Yak-9
# 144 02.04.1944 La-5
# 145 02.04.1944 La-5
# 146 02.04.1944 Pe-2
# 147 02.04.1944 Pe-2
# 148 04.04.1944 Il-2
# 149 04.04.1944 Il-2
# 150 04.04.1944 LaGG-3
# 151 04.04.1944 LaGG-3
# 152 04.04.1944 La-5
# 153 24.04.1944 Yak-9
# 154 24.04.1944 La-5
# 155 26.05.1944 La-5
# 156 30.05.1944 Pe-2
# 157 30.05.1944 La-5
# 158 02.06.1944 LaGG-3
# 159 05.06.1944 Yak-9
# 160 28.06.1944 Il-2
# 161 28.06.1944 P-39
# 162 28.06.1944 Il-2
# 163 28.06.1944 P-39
# 164 28.06.1944 Il-2
# 165 29.06.1944 P-39
# 166 30.06.1944 P-39
# 167 30.06.1944 Yak-9
# 168 30.06.1944 Il-2
# 169 30.06.1944 Il-2
# 170 01.07.1944 P-39
# 171 02.07.1944 P-39
# 172 03.07.1944 P-39
# 173 03.07.1944 Il-2
# 174 04.07.1944 Il-2
# 175 04.07.1944 P-39
# 176 10.07.1944 P-39
# 177 16.07.1944 P-39
# 178 16.07.1944 Il-2
# 179 18.07.1944 Yak-9
# 180 18.07.1944 Yak-9
# 181 21.07.1944 Il-2
# 182 21.07.1944 Yak-9
# 183 21.07.1944 Yak-9
# 184 22.07.1944 Il-2
# 185 22.07.1944 Il-2
# 186 22.07.1944 Il-2
# 187 24.07.1944 Pe-2
# 188 24.07.1944 Pe-2
# 189 29.07.1944 Il-2
# 190 29.07.1944 Il-2
# 191 01.08.1944 Yak-9
# 192 01.08.1944 Yak-9
# 193 01.08.1944 Yak-9
# 194 07.08.1944 Yak-9
# 195 15.08.1944 Yak-9
# 196 15.08.1944 Yak-9
# 197 15.08.1944 Il-2
# 198 17.08.1944 Pe-2
# 199 25.08.1944 P-39
# 200 26.08.1944 Yak-9
# 201 26.08.1944 La-5
# 202 27.08.1944 Il-2
# 203 28.08.1944 Yak-9
# 204 28.08.1944 Yak-9
# 205 28.08.1944 Yak-9
# 206 31.08.1944 Il-2
# 207 31.08.1944 Il-2
# 208 31.08.1944 Il-2
# 209 14.09.1944 Yak-9
# 210 14.09.1944 Yak-9
# 211 14.09.1944 Il-2
# 212 14.09.1944 Il-2
# 213 14.09.1944 Il-2
# 214 14.09.1944 Yak-9
# 215 15.09.1944 Il-2
# 216 15.09.1944 Il-2
# 217 16.09.1944 Il-2
# 218 17.09.1944 Pe-2
# 219 17.09.1944 P-39
# 220 17.09.1944 Pe-2
# 221 20.09.1944 Yak-9
# 222 20.09.1944 Yak-9
# 223 22.09.1944 La-5
# 224 28.09.1944 Pe-2
# 225 28.09.1944 Pe-2
# 226 28.09.1944 Pe-2
# 227 28.09.1944 Yak-9
# 228 30.09.1944 Yak-9
# 229 30.09.1944 Il-2
# 230 30.09.1944 Il-2
# 231 07.10.1944 Yak-9
# 232 09.10.1944 Il-2
# 233 09.10.1944 Il-2
# 234 09.10.1944 Il-2
# 235 09.10.1944 Il-2
# 236 09.10.1944 Il-2
# 237 10.10.1944 La-5
# 238 10.10.1944 Il-2
# 239 10.10.1944 Il-2
# 240 14.10.1944 La-5
# 241 16.10.1944 La-5
# 242 16.10.1944 Il-2
# 243 16.10.1944 Il-2
# 244 16.10.1944 Il-2
# 245 17.10.1944 La-5
# 246 18.10.1944 Il-2
# 247 18.10.1944 Il-2
# 248 22.10.1944 Yak-3
# 249 27.10.1944 Yak-9
# 250 27.10.1944 Yak-9
# 251 27.10.1944 Il-2
# 252 27.10.1944 Pe-2
# 253 27.10.1944 Pe-2
# 254 27.10.1944 Il-2
# 255 27.10.1944 Il-2
# 256 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 257 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 258 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 259 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 260 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 261 29.10.1944 Il-2
# 262 30.10.1944 Il-2
# 263 30.10.1944 Il-2
# 264 30.10.1944 Il-2
# 265 19.11.1944 La-5


plus 2 unconfirmed Il2's on 30.06.1941 and the Il-2 on 16.02.1945.
The former plus his 265 confirmed might add up to his widespread total of 267 while the latter wasn't counted to his total, was it ?
We need some bulletin from the Schwerter award that reveals if his total was 267 after 19Nov and before his last flight.

Have a nice evening,

Michael
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