Bf109 WNr:1980

[Col Bruggy]

Originally Posted by ouidjat

Conclusion: there is no information concerning 1980

Well, there is one reference to Bf109E WNr 1980, from a respected source!

Wednesday, November 22 (1939) - LUFTWAFFE.

1./JG76 Messerschmitt Bf109E-3 (1304) Shot down by S/Lt Thierry, Adj Combette, and Sgt Bellefin of GC I/3 in combat between Hornsburg and Bitche and forced-landed at Goersdorf, 2 km north-east of Woerth, 11.45 a.m. Also attacked by S/Lt Cuffaut and Sgt de Bremond d' Ars of GC II/6. Fw K. Hier captured unhurt. Aircraft 1 a write-off...

On September 20, it (AE479) was allocated to the AFDU Northolt, where the tail assembly was subsequently damaged in a crash-landing on January 5, 1941. After repair, using the tail unit from another captured Bf109E (W.Nr.1980), it was allotted to No. 1426 (enemy Aircraft Flight at Duxford on December 11, and eventually shipped to the USA on April 7, 1942 for evaluation at Wright Field. The following month, on May 14, it crashed during a test flight and was finally scrapped at Chanute Field on November 26, 1942.

See:
The Battle Of France Then and Now.
Cornwell, Peter D.
Old Harlow:Battle of Britain International,2007.
pp.118 & 538 (Luftwaffe Aircraft Index).

Rightly or wrongly, that was what Peter Cornwell wrote in 2007.

Conversely, there is no mention of a Bf109E WNr. 1980 in the Aircraft Index in The Battle of Britain Then and Now Mk.V (pp.805-808), nor in the Werke Numbers Index in Luftwaffe Crash Archive Volume 12 (pp.1488-1498 (see pp.1497-8).

Col.

[ouidjat]

Originally Posted by Col Bruggy

Well, there is one reference to Bf109E WNr 1980, from a respected source!

Wednesday, November 22 (1939) - LUFTWAFFE.

1./JG76 Messerschmitt Bf109E-3 (1304) Shot down by S/Lt Thierry, Adj Combette, and Sgt Bellefin of GC I/3 in combat between Hornsburg and Bitche and forced-landed at Goersdorf, 2 km north-east of Woerth, 11.45 a.m. Also attacked by S/Lt Cuffaut and Sgt de Bremond d' Ars of GC II/6. Fw K. Hier captured unhurt. Aircraft 1 a write-off...

On September 20, it (AE479) was allocated to the AFDU Northolt, where the tail assembly was subsequently damaged in a crash-landing on January 5, 1941. After repair, using the tail unit from another captured Bf109E (W.Nr.1980), it was allotted to No. 1426 (enemy Aircraft Flight at Duxford on December 11, and eventually shipped to the USA on April 7, 1942 for evaluation at Wright Field. The following month, on May 14, it crashed during a test flight and was finally scrapped at Chanute Field on November 26, 1942.

See:
The Battle Of France Then and Now.
Cornwell, Peter D.
Old Harlow:Battle of Britain International,2007.
pp.118 & 538 (Luftwaffe Aircraft Index).

Rightly or wrongly, that was what Peter Cornwell wrote in 2007.

Conversely, there is no mention of a Bf109E WNr. 1980 in the Aircraft Index in The Battle of Britain Then and Now Mk.V (pp.805-808), nor in the Werke Numbers Index in Luftwaffe Crash Archive Volume 12 (pp.1488-1498 (see pp.1497-8).

Col.

You just proved what I wrote that you want or not. There is absolutely NO information about 1980. Unit? Pilot? Stkz.? When and where it was lost in Britain? Nothing ... Peanuts.
Have a nice day.

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by ouidjat

There is absolutely NO information about 1980.

Well, self-evidently there's SOME information, just not as much as you might want.

[ouidjat]

Originally Posted by Nick Beale

Well, self-evidently there's SOME information, just not as much as you might want.

[Stig Jarlevik]

Gents

Il all thus boils down to if von Werra's aircraft was WNr 1480 or 1980.

The photo evidence certainly suggests 1980 but a worn digit 4 could easily have been interpreted
as a digit 9 when/if someone felt the visible digits on the fin needed to be enhanced for some
reason or other.

All the "evidence" material quoted so far is second hand except the photo!
What does the original material say?

Cheers
Stig

[pvanroy]

There's a photograph of the left side of the tail of von Werra's aircraft that quite unequivocally shows W.Nr. 1480 - which indicates the aircraft was originally built as an E-3 by Erla between August 1939 and April 1940, and must have been upgraded to E-4 standard sometime later. W.Nr. 1980 was an Erla-built E-4 from a batch constructed between April and June 1940.

[Alex Smart]

Thank you Gentlemen for all your inputs.
The details offered by Col from the BoB then & Now vol V is what I had , but this from War Prizes by Phil Butler.
Summarization-
AE479( ex 'White 1' of JG76 WNr.1304) had a landing accident on the 5th January 41and repaired using the tail of WNr.1480. It arrived at Wright Field, Dayton,Ohio on the 14th May '42.Damaged beyond repair on 3rd November '42 at Cambridge, Ohio.
So if 1304 was repaired by using the tail or part of the tail of 1480, that's fine. But what is known of any repairs done in France prior to 1304 being flown to Britain (still with French roundeld and tail stripes) ? Is that where 1980 comes into the picture ???
Thanks to all for your interesting comments.
Alex

PS
On pages 60/61 of war Prizes the album (photos of the aircraft 1304 are shown,
The one in French markings shows what definitely looks like 1304. While the one at the top on page 61 now in British markings definitely shows WNr.1980. But the accompanying text refers to 1480.

Also from the photo supplied in an earlier post(4) shows 1980 on arrival in the USA.