Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum  

Go Back   Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum > Discussion > Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces

Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces Please use this forum to discuss the German Luftwaffe and the Air Forces of its Allies.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 27th October 2011, 17:50
Nick Beale's Avatar
Nick Beale Nick Beale is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Exeter, England
Posts: 6,152
Nick Beale is a jewel in the roughNick Beale is a jewel in the roughNick Beale is a jewel in the roughNick Beale is a jewel in the rough
Re: Documentation on squadron sized actions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Lander View Post
Hi,

for the air War in the Mediterranean:-


Bruce Lander
And maybe "Air War Italy 1944–45" by Beale, D'Amico & Valentini" (Airlife, 1996)? Most of the daylight actions in the period we covered were at squadron-level or below and we were very keen to identify the participants on either side.

For Northwest Europe, Martin Middlebrook's "The Schweinfurt-Regensburg Mission" would fit the bill as would Alfred Price and Jeffrey Ethell's "Target Berlin: Mission 250: 6 March 1944."
__________________
Nick Beale
http://www.ghostbombers.com
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 27th October 2011, 18:58
Don Caldwell's Avatar
Don Caldwell Don Caldwell is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 225
Don Caldwell
Re: Documentation on squadron sized actions

Hi Keith --

The members of this board have taken a lot of time and trouble in the past few days to educate you, and I hope that you're no longer "puzzled at the lack of documentation on squadron sized air battles in the ETO." If I may be permitted to summarize:

1. The larger the battle, the more difficult it is to match up opponents even at the Group/Gruppe level, much less at the individual victor/victim level.

2. Most Luftwaffe records were destroyed, either at the unit level on orders from Berlin as V-E Day approached, or in a large 8th Air Force raid on Luftwaffe headquarters in Berlin on 3 Feb 45.

AFAIK, books in English have covered eight specific dates in the day war over the Reich in detail, but perhaps not in the detail that you want. Keep in mind that no pilot knows who he's fighting or even the unit of his opponent. These match-ups have to be inferred by researchers using the data available from both sides. In my case I look for matches in time, location, and circumstances, and the absence of any contradictory data. Only if all four conditions are met am I ready to declare a match with confidence. One reason I picked JG 26 to study in detail is that there were more data available in the BA-MA for that Geschwader than any other. Also, its battles in 1941-42, the period of its greatest successes, were small in scale and relatively easy to sort out, and, when I started, a number of veterans were accessible and eager to talk.

My new book "Day Fighters in Defense of the Reich" has been held up at the printer but is now scheduled for November release. It will not fill your specific needs, although it does have a few combat matchups, but will help illustrate the difficulty of filling those needs and clear up a few things for you -- e.g., most Defense of the Reich units operated from well-established bases, were fully staffed, and I'm sure kept good records -- they were just forced to destroy them. The "Fire Brigade" concept was valid for certain units at certain times, but can't be blamed for the data deficit. What the book does contain in its 480 pages is a brief description of every battle between the Reich defense forces (broadly defined) and the US 8th and 15th Air Forces. There are tables containing statistics for every Gruppe involved -- but these don't always contain such basic information as the numbers of fighters scrambled by each Gruppe, because the war diaries containing that information no longer exist. There are also maps for 32 battles showing the point of contact of each airborne Jagdgruppe with the bomber stream, and more info. Look for the book (published by Frontline). It'll give you the big picture of the day battles over the Reich in greater detail than ever before and point you to specific battles, if you want to do your own research in the archives -- it'll help if you can afford to travel and can read German.

Horrido!

Don Caldwell
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 27th October 2011, 19:23
drgondog's Avatar
drgondog drgondog is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 912
drgondog is on a distinguished road
Re: Documentation on squadron sized actions

Hey Don - I will want to buy a copy from you. Also, I finally went to the darkside and signed with Schiffer on mine. I hope some of my stuff proved useful for you.

Warm Regards,

Bill
__________________
" The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 27th October 2011, 19:53
Don Caldwell's Avatar
Don Caldwell Don Caldwell is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 225
Don Caldwell
Re: Documentation on squadron sized actions

Hi Bill --

You're on my e-mail list to notify as soon as I have books. Unfortunately, I don't even know who the US distributor will be. I've made good but limited use of your 355FG info in this book, and would use more of it in one of the two followup books I have in mind. I want to use the same format as my previous two books, and don't know if any UK publisher will want it, leaving me with Schiffer. Please keep me updated on your experiences with them.

-- Don
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 29th October 2011, 16:56
Keith Enge Keith Enge is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6
Keith Enge is on a distinguished road
Re: Documentation on squadron sized actions

Thanks again everyone for the help. It has been and will be useful to flesh out my coverage of the Mediterranean theater, both Western Desert and post-armistice.

Keith
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Friendly fire WWII Brian Allied and Soviet Air Forces 803 8th July 2023 15:47
RAF and RAAF ORBs available on the Web Laurent Rizzotti Allied and Soviet Air Forces 43 23rd October 2015 14:46
RAF losses 5./6. March 1945 JanZ Allied and Soviet Air Forces 13 25th February 2012 12:40
Any dispute about interpreting the BofB? tcolvin Allied and Soviet Air Forces 57 17th October 2010 21:31
Order of battle RAF & B.E.F. on May 10,1940 fredcompa Allied and Soviet Air Forces 2 20th November 2006 21:23


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 18:55.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net