Bomber Losses 11 Aug 43

[Alex Smart]

Hello Chris,

Perhaps looking at the time's ( only minutes apart 14.25;1436;14.42) Schnoll attacked the Dakota after the initial two fighters attacked. Maybe he finished her off and was not seen by Bell also is it known if Schnoll's attack in the same area as that of Treicke and Walther's attack ?

From Tony Wood's lists:

11. August 1943
11.08.43 Uffz. Treicke 16./KG 2 Stirling �� 02 / 00716: 2.800 m. 14.25 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Ltn. Walther 16./KG 2 Stirling �� 0134: 3.000 m. 14.36 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: ASM
Fliegerführer Atlantik: v. R.A.F. Coastal Command
11.08.43 Fw. Alois Schnoll 8./JG 2 Douglas �� 5226 / 14 West: 6.000 m. 14.42 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.198
11.08.43 Ltn. Gerhard Blankenberg 13./KG 40 Mosquito �� 0845 / 14 West: 300 m. 17.50 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Ltn. Dieter Meister 13./KG 40 Flzg. boot �� 1836 / 24 West: 300-500 m. 18.16 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
Supplemental Claims from Sources:
11.08.43 Staffelabschuss V./KG 40 Sunderland �� - - Reference: CG MSS f. 213

Stirling - ?
Stirling - ?
Dakota - 42-92061
Mosquito - DZ375
Sunderland - DP177

8th AAF lost a B-24 shortly after take off at 0501.
RAF Coastal lost a Liberator GR V of 200 Sqdn BZ832.
BC 1657 HCU lost Stirling N6080 in a landing accident at 1655.

Aug 43
10 - 1 Stirling (BF321).
10/11 - 3 Stirling's (BF460;BF516;EE885).
11 - 1 Stirling (N6080).
12 - 1 Stirling (N3700).

Alex

[Chris Goss]

Schnoll's location of 14W matches perfectly where the C-47 came down but Trenke's location is nowhere near France

[Theo Boiten]

Hi all,

These two claims were night claims. Details from an original KTB held in private hands, I've had the opportunity to take these details from the original document, all these wil be published in the 2nd edition of the NJWD), the first Abschuss concerns the loss of a 115 Squadron Lancaster that broke up in the air and crashed near Maidstone at 04.30 hrs, I've no matching loss to the second 'Stirling' claim:

Fw. Johann Trenke: 1 16./KG2 Stirling British coast, Pl.Q. 02/00716: 2.800 m. 04.25 115 Sqn Lancaster DS665
Lt. Hermann Walther: 1 16./KG2 Stirling Pl.Q. 0134: 3.000 m. 04.36 unidentified

Cheers, Theo

[Chris Goss]

Theo-This makes sense. DS665/KO-N broke up & crashed at East Hall Farm, Boughton Monchelsea, Kent but no mention is made of fighter action

[Alex Smart]

Hello,
Perhaps this is of some help ?

Night: 10-11. August 1943
R.A.F. Bomber Command: NUREMBURG
11.08.43 Oblt. Fritz Söthe 3./NJG 4 Halifax �� Wambrechies: 5.200 m. 00.03 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Oblt. Heinz Schnaufer II./NJG 1 Lancaster �� S. Hähnlein: 5.400 m. [S.S.W. Darmstadt] 00.32 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.106
11.08.43 Uffz. Horst John 2./JG Herrmann Halifax �� Mannheim: 5.500 m. 00.36 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Hptm. Friedrich-Karl Müller I./JG Herrmann Halifax �� 3-5 km. N.N.E. Fl.Pl. Biblis: 4.200 m. 00.44 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Hptm. Friedrich-Karl Müller I./JG Herrmann Halifax �� Vermütlich N. Heidelberg: 4.200 m. 00.45 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
11.08.43 Uffz. Kustusch 3./NJG 4 Halifax �� Boussu: 1.600 m. [12 km. W.S.W. Mons] 02.12 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.128
11.08.43 Fw. Otto Fries 5./NJG 1 Lancaster �� Hanzinelle: 3.500 m. [S.E. Charleroi] 02.56 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.51
11.08.43 Ltn. Johannes Hager 4./NJG 1 Stirling �� 1 km. S.E. Doische: 3.700 m. [Walloon] 03.25 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.107
Supplemental Claims from Sources:
11.08.43 Hptm. Heinrich Wohlers Stab I./NJG 6 Halifax �� Bad Kreuznach 00.37 Reference: Kock NJG 6
11.08.43 Hptm. Heinrich Wohlers Stab I./NJG 6 Stirling �� Schaffhausen - Reference: Kock NJG 6
11.08.43 Oblt. Hans Jörg Birkenstock Stab I./NJG 6 Lancaster �� Alsenborn - Reference: Kock NJG 6
11.08.43 Hptm. Heinrich Wohlers Stab I./NJG 6 Halifax �� Ansbach 00.37 Reference: Kock NJG 6

Fliegerführer Atlantik: v. R.A.F. Coastal Command
12.08.43 -Staffelabschuss- V./KG 40 B-24 w.b. �� - 15.28 Reference: CG MSS f. 213

Night: 11-12. August 1943
12.08.43 Uffz. Ernst Petretti 2./JG 2 Halifax �� La Café: 3.000 m. 23.10 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
12.08.43 Ltn. Detlef Grossfuss 2./JG 2 Halifax �� 1 km. N.N.W. Verneuil: 3.000 m. 23.17 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
12.08.43 Ltn. Detlef Grossfuss 2./JG 2 Halifax �� bei Beaune: 3.000 m. 23.27 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr. -
13.08.43 Hptm. Wolfgang von Niebelschütz 5./NJG 4 Lancaster �� Labuissière: 3.500-3.000 m. 02.42 Film C. 2031/II Anerk: Nr.13

Alex