Unit code U4+-K

[Larry deZeng]

Hi there Mr. Merlin!

The highly authoritative source below clearly states in Band II/p.400 second paragraph the following in reference to Erg.KGr. 4:

Einen Monat später [i.e., late October or November 1939] wurde die Gruppe unter der Führung der Luftflotte 4 in ErgKGr 4 unbenannt und bekam das VKz. U4+ zugewiesen.

That's good enough for me.

[Source: Carlsen/Meyer-Die Flugzeugführer-Ausbildung der deutschen Luftwaffe 1935-1945/Bd.2:400,411.]

P.S. it would be very helpful for all of us here, Mr. Merlin, if you would be kind enough to step forward and identify yourself as many of the rest of us have done. You also correct everyone else without ever offering sources. If we are to take your pronouncements seriously and not just as unsubstantiated opinion, then source citations would be a big step in the right direction. Furthermore, I believe sourcing is required by the rules here. Thank you very much.

L.

[Rasmussen]

Regarding flight log Hirschmann the unit code U4+_K was used by 2./Lehrgruppe Ju 88 in Greifswald in 12/1939 and 01/1940. Later - since March 1940 - he was in Barth (after an short detachment in Brandis with BFS 1) with Erg.KGr.5 again with Ju 88, Ju 87 and He 111 with U4+_K - code. Regarding the flight log Karpenkiel the code U4+_H was used by 1./ Lehrgruppe Ju 88 in Greifswald on Ju 88 in November and Dezember 1939. This would confirm the statement from Merlin.

Interesting too that his statement from page 400 is not confirmed by his statement on page 411, where the Lehrgruppe Ju88 existed to February 1940 and the Erg.KGr.4 existed since March 1940.

[Seaplanes]

Thank you to all of you for the many contributions. From my own notes as well as the site ww2.dk and Your contributions, it now seems quite obvious that the Lehrgruppe Ju 88 was formed in November 1939 and redesignated Ergänzungskampfgruppe 4 with Stab, 1. and 2. Staffel on 1. March 1940. When the unit code U4+ was assigned is not yet quite clear.

[Chris Goss]

Definitely in use on a Do 17 M on 4 Apr 40

[Merlin]

Here is a more detailed proof for the use of the unit code U4:
on Do 17 from 28.11.39 (Flugbuch Rinck) to 24.04.40 (Hirschmann)
on Ju 87 from unknown to 11.04.40 (Stahl)
on Ju 88 from 3.11.39 (Podeyn) to 10.04.40 (Aufdemkamp)
on He 111 from 17.11.39 (Rinck) to 7.05.40 (Hirschmann)

I hope this helps.

[Larry deZeng]

Thank you, Gerhard Stemmer.

Your very name adds credibility and authority to your postings here. Most Luftwaffe enthusiasts know your name and have great respect for your opinion and position on all matters concerning the Luftwaffe. There are few of us that do not have at least one book authored or co-authored by you. Of course, sourcing (Quellenangaben) is important, too. In this case concerning U4+ , I see that your source is the various Flugbücher you have listed.

L.

[Seaplanes]

Thanks to Merlin (Gerhard). This prove beyond doubt that the code was issued to Lehrgruppe Ju 88 and was "inherited" by Ergänzungskampfgruppe 4.

[Rasmussen]

Originally Posted by Seaplanes

This prove beyond doubt that the code was issued to Lehrgruppe Ju 88 ...

Ahh, I need an "name" ... an prove with log books and stamps is not enough (I wrote the same in #12) ...