Natural metal Spitfires.

[Alex Smart]

Hi All,

I know it is a short and a simple reply but wern't Spitfires that were in Desert camoflage sceme in Italy removed from squadrons and re painted in the Grey/green camoflage more suited to northern climbs ? it is then possible that some were redelivered to Squadrons when needed before the "New" camoflage was applied ?

Alex

[Graham Boak]

Stefaan: PR in the RAF was something of a private air force, reporting to high command and (at least later in life) largely concentrating on strategic reconnaissance. They were allowed to go their own way with camouflage schemes, although settling on the well-known PRU Blue. FR units were fighters with cameras, flying tactical missions, reporting to local authority and the relevant Army HQs. These grew out of the old Army Air Co-Operation units, and were normally camouflaged in the same schemes as fighter aircraft in the same theatre. So although both flew Spitfires with cameras, they had distinctly different roles and positions in the organisation.


Alex, you may well be right, although the need wouldn't seem that desperate and the apparent concentration of these in SAAF units does imply something else. However, if 41 Sq was dedicated to the interception of intruders, and these bare metal aircraft have been seen in other units, then we can probably rule out the search for performance limits. It begins to look as though local SAAF HQ relaxed the rules on camouflage before the RAF as a whole.

Maybe, however, someone will bring to the forum a mass of photos of baremetal RAF fighters in Italy.....

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Graham Boak

However, the Ju 86s were long gone before the time this thread is referring to. I think the Ar 234 is the most likely candidate requiring such measures, although perhaps the Ju 88T is a possibility. The other type involved was the Me 410, but catching these seem to have been within the capabilities of the standard Spitfire. Perhaps this is an opportunity for specialists in Luftwaffe reconnaissance to comment?

I know nothing about the silver Spitfires but can maybe shed some light on what they might have wanted to catch.

The standard Spitfire could catch an Me 410 but what if it wasn't a standard Me 410?

On 24 July 1944, No. 92 Squadron Spits chased a "silver-painted" Me 410 from Cosrsica to Nice and couldn't catch it. After the Riviera landings an abandoned Me 410 (ex 1.(F)/33) was found with the barbettes removed and a GM-1 tank in their place. Some more about this on my website www.ghostbombers.com (Go to the "Operation Dragoon" article and then to the page "Before D-Day")

[SteveB]

Originally Posted by SteveB

TO: WAR ORG

SILVER SPITFIRES

The unpainted Spitfire IXs which are being prepared may be sent as normal replacements to any T.A.F. Spitfire Wings except those in Corsica.

Wing Commander
Combat Operations
21st May 1944

Stefaan

I have been away on business for a few days.

You asked about this document. It is from the National Archives (PRO) at Kew. It comes from AIR51 I do not have the precise details of which piece in AIR51. The papers are from SHAEF and from MAAF HQ. All the records are on microfilm which was apparently made many years ago it is poor quality and often completely illegible/indecipherable. As far as I know this document has no link to a particular Wing it seems to me it was sent from MAAF HQ to all Wings(?). There is no confusion over the date so it would seem that it does not link with a/c being operated in NMF during 1943.

I hope this helps a bit I cannot add anything further

Steve

[stefaan]

Thanks.

Stefaan