Gabreski T-Bolt Questions

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by rpeck350

Thanks Pete for posting.
Top row are all with FW-190's on top with the extra 3 on the bottom the last one says ME-109.Which makes sence in that his last four victories were ME-109's.
We might never know.
Rick

There are more mysteries - as of July 7 (his last ground score - an He 111), Gabreski had 28 and 3.5 ground - and a lot of fighter pilots put up a 'full' flag for a partial score. If he had had enough time (and cared) for 8th AF VCB to confirm all his claims - the last 2 109's plus the He 111 would still be a 'claim- pending review status' and could have resulted in 31 flags by late July/early August (when he was POW).

In all my father's awards there was usually at least 30 days from Group intel sending stuff up to 8th AF VCB and getting the word back.

His last three scores were
Me 109 June 27 - air
Me 109 July 5 - air
He 111 July 7 - ground

[Franek Grabowski]

I am wondering if flags on the night shot are not blended because of filter use. Another possibility is that they were retouched, but there is no doubt traces of them are visible.

[SMF144]

Nope. Can't see that happening. Maybe covered up while they painted over the D-Day Invasion stripes but the filter, if used, wouldn't do that.

Just wondering, Franek, but have you ever shot B&W film with different filters?

[SMF144]

True, but if you study the last three flags there are salient points that match with the three above hence the obvious.

Originally Posted by drgondog

There are more mysteries - as of July 7 (his last ground score - an He 111), Gabreski had 28 and 3.5 ground - and a lot of fighter pilots put up a 'full' flag for a partial score. If he had had enough time (and cared) for 8th AF VCB to confirm all his claims - the last 2 109's plus the He 111 would still be a 'claim- pending review status' and could have resulted in 31 flags by late July/early August (when he was POW).

In all my father's awards there was usually at least 30 days from Group intel sending stuff up to 8th AF VCB and getting the word back.

His last three scores were
Me 109 June 27 - air
Me 109 July 5 - air
He 111 July 7 - ground

[lampie]

Originally Posted by SMF144

Nope. Can't see that happening. Maybe covered up while they painted over the D-Day Invasion stripes but the filter, if used, wouldn't do that.

Just wondering, Franek, but have you ever shot B&W film with different filters?

All I see is light reflecting off the area where the kill marking stickers are.
There are documented photos of Gabreskis Thunderbolt from around July 6th 1944 showing 28 kill markings in place and the upper surface invasion stripes removed.
The area where the ground crew members names were recorded also shows up as a shiny rectangular reflection on many photos.

Also,,yet again,,the photos of HV-A on the ground after belly landing show clearly 28 kill markings.

Im getting bored now.

[Franek Grabowski]

Originally Posted by SMF144

Nope. Can't see that happening. Maybe covered up while they painted over the D-Day Invasion stripes but the filter, if used, wouldn't do that.

Just wondering, Franek, but have you ever shot B&W film with different filters?

Yes, I did, though years ago. Note, that the red nose is rather pale and blending with the surround, I presume red or orange filter may have been used to darken the sky and to get better night effect. This, combined with rather smooth nature of Shacki's transfers, may have resulted with the effect. Rectangular greyish (or rather grayish) patches are clearly visible in photo software.

[lampie]

In the night photograph, the lighting is augmented by at least 2 extra light sources.
One almost directly in front of the aircraft illuminating the ground crew members and the other illuminating the two pilots.
You can clearly see in the photo the pools of light on the ground eminating from the light sources.

As regards the bottom section of the cowling appearing paler. Is anyone familiar with the old trick of viewing a potential second hand car purchase under sodium street lighting?
Any panels painted that have been touched up or repainted are imediately obvious under street lighting conditions.
Also,the areas in the photograph with more direct light will appear brighter and the unlit areas darker in comparrison.

My name on the site ,Lampie, comes from my profession as a lighting designer/technician of over 25 years standing just incase anyone was wondering.

Lets look back to the original point raised.

Quote...Was Gabby really downed in this a/c or is the serial number off?

Answer..yes he was,,and no it isnt. ( backed up by photographs)

Quote...
Clearly the same a/c with the upper invasion stripes painted over, painted canopy frame,and painted over kills..
Answers
HV-A did have its upper surface invasion stripes painted over as Mr Cook himself shows in the second photo of post # 3
The canopy frame is not painted over in the night photo, as again, Mr Cook shows in a later post.
(Answered two out of three all on your own Jack )
The stickers which the kill markings were printed on react differently to the light resulting, in my humble opinion, in a blurred reflection in the scoreboard area.

The photo is a staged "propoganda" photo using Gabbys aircraft.