A factory fresh Me 109G-G14AS

[Mermet]

Hello,

"- Unsure about bigger mainwheel, no wing bulges to be seen."

The bulges are to be seen on the color picture.

Cheers,
Jicehem

[Mermet]

Originally Posted by Cpt_Farrel

I'm quite convinced that it's not the light, look at the enginecowling, there's no way that it's only a shadow doing that. Also, I think it looks the same on "Yellow 5" in the JaPo book. The well known photo of Yellow 7 from JG300 probably show the same camo too, only that the engine cowling was replaced causing the effect that there's a dark band around the forward part of the nose, which in reality would have been the remains of a "round the cowling" RLM83 or RLM81 camo.

Veltro: Thanks for the decal theory by the way, that would explain my last problem with my own theory...

I desagree with you, but cordially : At the end of the war the markings applied on JG 300's planes included a black band around the tip of their noses. That xas the same regulation for their Fw such as Fw 190A-8/R8 "schwarze 4 + - of II./JG 300.

Cheers,
Jicehem

[RolandF]

Hi all,

I´m glad my info was helpful for you. As far as I know there weren´t any G-10s assembled at Vilseck factory. And there wasn´t any official repair workshop according to my sources.

Concerning the lack of any Stammkennzeichen I´ve got some evidence that those signs were applied after being successfully test-flown at Amberg-Schafhof. Some photos exist from belly-landed test a/c at Schafhof with the common-known hand-painted final digits of the Werk-Nr. Due to poor quality of those 109s this happened rather often. The skill of the workers and subcontractors was rather low let alone the attepts of sabotage by the KZ workers. So I do think work was restricted simply to the montage of prefabricated wings and fuselages - afaik additional production was carried out at Floss-Plankenhammer some 5 km distant from KZ Flossenbürg - so that repair of damaged planes was beyond of the skills of those workers.

After March 1944 Messerschmitt Regensburg spread its production all over the so-called Upper Palatinate ("Oberpfalz) in Northern Bavaria to escape the then extensive bombing. The patchwork look of many late-war 109s can be explained by this production methods.

The Stammkennzeichen was applied just before handing over the 109s to the Luftwaffe, there´s a photo of a snow-covered K-4 W.Nr. 332 707 at Schafhof ready for delivery. At Falcon´s an "N" of the last letter is visible. Schafhof airfield together with numerous planes was totally destroyed on April 18, 1945.

I´ve found a webpage about the "Einflug-Flugplatz Amberg-Schafhof" with more additional info about Stammkennzeichen, Werknummern and flight accidents - unfortunately only in German. For those who can read it:

http://www.flugplatz-amberg-schafhof...ugbetrieb.html

If you need some translation feel free to ask

Concerning the fences I´m quite sure they still exist. They used good quality and aluminum does not rust ;-)

Thanks

Roland

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Originally Posted by Mermet

Hello,

"- Unsure about bigger mainwheel, no wing bulges to be seen."

The bulges are to be seen on the color picture.

Cheers,
Jicehem

Dear JCM, can you provide us with a link or a bibliographical pointer for the colour picture? It would greatly improve a synthesis for our exchanges, isn'it?

Cheers

Marc

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Originally Posted by RolandF

Hi all,

I´m glad my info was helpful for you. As far as I know there weren´t any G-10s assembled at Vilseck factory. And there wasn´t any official repair workshop according to my sources.

Concerning the lack of any Stammkennzeichen I´ve got some evidence that those signs were applied after being successfully test-flown at Amberg-Schafhof. Some photos exist from belly-landed test a/c at Schafhof with the common-known hand-painted final digits of the Werk-Nr. Due to poor quality of those 109s this happened rather often. The skill of the workers and subcontractors was rather low let alone the attepts of sabotage by the KZ workers. So I do think work was restricted simply to the montage of prefabricated wings and fuselages - afaik additional production was carried out at Floss-Plankenhammer some 5 km distant from KZ Flossenbürg - so that repair of damaged planes was beyond of the skills of those workers.

After March 1944 Messerschmitt Regensburg spread its production all over the so-called Upper Palatinate ("Oberpfalz) in Northern Bavaria to escape the then extensive bombing. The patchwork look of many late-war 109s can be explained by this production methods.

The Stammkennzeichen was applied just before handing over the 109s to the Luftwaffe, there´s a photo of a snow-covered K-4 W.Nr. 332 707 at Schafhof ready for delivery. At Falcon´s an "N" of the last letter is visible. Schafhof airfield together with numerous planes was totally destroyed on April 18, 1945.

I´ve found a webpage about the "Einflug-Flugplatz Amberg-Schafhof" with more additional info about Stammkennzeichen, Werknummern and flight accidents - unfortunately only in German. For those who can read it:

http://www.flugplatz-amberg-schafhof...ugbetrieb.html

If you need some translation feel free to ask

Concerning the fences I´m quite sure they still exist. They used good quality and aluminum does not rust ;-)

Thanks

Roland

Dear Roland,

Thanks for the link, thanks for your further precise details and arguments. It seems thus we should not expect brand new 109G-10's on this airfield. So we have again the possibility of having a G-14, as a K-4 can be positively ruled out. As for the G-10 possibility, especially the extended wing bulges, well, let's hope the colour picture will shed some more light...

Again, thanks for your very argumented input, and for making me dream about 109 wing ribs as fences... Any plan to publish your documentation one day? That would make for a fascinating insight in the late war industry realities....

Cheers

Marc

[Mermet]

Dear Marc,

Unfortunately, this picture is the one printed in Airfoil No1 in... 1984.
I've no scan to send you a copy...

I suppose you speak very good French language to have written "Dear JCM". Am I right ?

Cheers,
JCM

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Cheer JCM

Reçu 5 sur 5! Supposition exacte! Mes amitiés au Sud depuis une Genève pluvieuse en diable...

Thanks for your reply. Are you really positive about the extendend wing bulges? What are the colours to be seen on the plane?

Thanks for your information!

As a side note, anybody here in the forum who could scan this picture from Airfoil 1, 1984?

Cheers

Marc

[PhilippeDM]

... Perhaps you should ask the permission of Mr. Shefflin, who is also member of this board and joining this discussion... Otherwise drop me a pm

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Hello Philippe,

Thanks for the information, I didn't know he owned the rights for this photo. And thanks for your offer; I will first ask Mr. Shefflin.

Cheers

Marc

Dear Mr. Shefflin, I hereby allow myself to ask you if you would be kindly provide us with a scan of the colour picture of this much discussed Me 109G. this could help settle some of the issues we're discussiing in this thread. Thanks so much in advance

Yours

Marc

[Mermet]

Originally Posted by Marc-André Haldimann

Are you really positive about the extendend wing bulges? What are the colours to be seen on the plane?

Yes, I am positive about the bulges which are of the extended model.

The plane has been shot from 3/4 front left side and is behind two GIs repairing what appears to be a motorcycle... They are, without doubt, the main subject of the picture !

The picture is relatively small (57x87 mm) and was taken against the sun (about 60°) from the left and, I think, seemingly at the end of the afternoon. It is a little underexposed and, also, not well printed (too high a contrast). This is the reason why the shadows appear black. The surfaces under the light are of a light color of grey-green. The propeller blades and the black part of the spinner are dark grey, such as a well lighten satin blak surface. The top of the forward end of the oil tank cowling is the same rendering as the leading edge of the wings. We can see the first exhaust stack in rust color. The back side of the cockpit is apparently well in RLM 66. There is a redish area under the left wing but I think it's due to the reflexion ot the color of the ground against a natural metal surface.

Cheers,

Jicéhem