IV/JG 54 info

[Nokose]

Gehrings claim was 05 Ost/52223 which is west of Arnhem. Budde’s claim is 52233 which puts it in Arnhem.

[John Manrho]

I have both as 52233. Prien too. This is 1.5 km south of Velp. Both claims are only one minute apart.

[John Manrho]

One more comment on the 98 Sqn. 2nd TAF report says the following;

"One box of 6 Mitchells attacked by approx. 12 Fw 190's. Two a/c were seen to be on fire going into cloud but apparently still under control. 2 parachutes seen".

I also checked the other Mitchell's serial. All except one flew mission on the next day, so these were not damaged. Only the one were a wounded crewmember was reported (by Flak) did not fly until Sept. 29th. So perhaps some battle damage there. It could be that damage was in reality not caused by Flak but by fighters, but I think that would have been reported.

John

[Nokose]

John in JFV 13/V page 471 it lists 25.09.44 14./JG 54 Uffz. Klaus Gehring B-25 (3) 18:01 PlQu. 05 Ost/52223, 14./JG 54 Lt. Alfred Budde B-25 (19) 1802 05 Ost/52233.

I noticed on your site a Fw 190 A-8 for the 29 September 44 for IV/JG 54 that is not in his book. Also several German fighters of different JG that crashed around Arnhem in his book for 29 Sep 44 that are not on the site. I will PM them to you later.

[John Manrho]

Oeps, thought I checked that, but that was another list. I believe Bock made a mistake here and it should be 52233 for Gehring too. See also Tony Wood list. This should be the same location as claim is 1 minute apart and the Mitchell's flew in one box.

Yes, I have one more IV./JG 54 loss for 29.9.44 based on other primary sources. The info on Uffz. Bach is correct, precise location however is unknown. Location of Uffz. Egerer also as he is still MIA.

The site shows only losses that happened within the NL-borders/waters or those crashed outside NL but where crew was buried in the NL. Apparently I found info that those other 29.9.44 losses did not happen in the NL....

Cheers,

John

[Nokose]

John, Still in the long run it’s not going to make it easy to determine any individual for that one bomber. Nick Hector sent me a listing of 2nd TAF claims for the 29th September 1944 in which there seems to be more Allied claims then actual German losses and they indicate heavily around Nijmegan and Emmerich. Prien’s book has a lot of losses that state in area of Arnhem.

[John Manrho]

Yes, a lot of losses were reported in the Arnhem-Nijmegen area, but a lot of crashes actually happened on German soil. If you put a list up here for 29.9.44 I can give what I have established as crash locations.

[Nokose]

Will start with JG 11 for 29 September 44
Gefr Heinz Schweickhardt 11/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (732 056) Arnhem

Fw. Otto Keck 9/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (732 067) Arnhem (KIA)

Gefr. Kurt Paulilo 10/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (731 801) area of Holland (MIA)

Uffz Josef Donner 10/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (175 216) Emmerich (WIA)

Uffz Walter Schmitt 11/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (732 113) Arnhem (MIA)

Uffz Ludwig Rössner. 11/JG 11 Fw 190 A-8 (380 165) Arnhem (KIA)

[John Manrho]

Perhaps we should start a new thread headed "Luftwaffe losses 29.9.1944 during Arnhem battle" and leave this thread to IV./JG 54.

Okay, moderator takes too long. New thread started for 29.9.44. Let's keep this thread for IV./JG 54 stuff only.

Regards,

John

[Nokose]

While I am still working on the 29th September 44, I have a different day to ask help on. On the 5 September 44 in Poland the Il-2 gunners made a claim for 2 Fw 190. So is there any loss listed for IV/JG 54 on this day?