A couple of questions regarding Bob Goebel

[NickM]

Guys:

Need your help & your thoughts on the following:

Am reading Bob Goebel's 'Mustang Ace' book and a question came up; On April 21, 1944 the 31st FG made its first visit to Ploesti; they claimed 16 vics & suffered 4 losses; I checked my Romanian reading material (ADMITTEDLY rather sketchy!) and IF I recall correctly Romanians only suffered 4 losses from April to May; where any German Units involved & if so, what were THEIR losses? THIS Might well be the wrong forum but...oh well...

Another question RE: Bob Goebel: I read an article in passing that maybe it was Goebel and his flight that forced down Eric Hartman in his famous 'one-versus-many' dogfight against mustangs that he had to bail out due to fuel starvation....any thoughts on this? I did NOT get the article, mind you...so I am working from memory...

TIA

NickM

[Csaba B. Stenge]

Nick,

I have better details about the Romanians over the eastern front but there are some very detailed publications about their fights against the US planes as well, which shows much more losses and not just on that particular day (IIRC on 21 April at least 8 IAR pilots were killed by the Mustangs of the 31st FG)

Regarding the other story: yes, it was probably Bob Goebel (I have his remembrance and discussed that story with him as well)

[NickM]

Originally Posted by Csaba Becze

Nick,

I have better details about the Romanians over the eastern front but there are some very detailed publications about their fights against the US planes as well, which shows much more losses and not just on that particular day (IIRC on 21 April at least 8 IAR pilots were killed by the Mustangs of the 31st FG)

Regarding the other story: yes, it was probably Bob Goebel (I have his remembrance and discussed that story with him as well)

Thanks! Wow, EIGHT pilots KIA? And my more generic sources don't even mention this day! I don't suppose you got any details as to how many German and/or Romanian aircraft were lost on this day?

NickM

[Dénes Bernád]

Originally Posted by NickM

Thanks! Wow, EIGHT pilots KIA?

In fact, a total of eleven I.A.R. 80 fighter pilots were killed that bloody day in clashes with 31st F.G. Mustangs, and a further six pilots wounded, as follows:
Gr. 1 vân.: 5+2,
Gr. 2 vân.: 2+4,
Gr. 6 vân.: 4+0
There were further combat losses suffered by ARR fighter pilots...

Originally Posted by NickM

And my more generic sources don't even mention this day!

I don't know what source you may call "more generic"; however, details were included in my book on Rumanian aces, published by Osprey in 2003.

[NickM]

Originally Posted by Dénes Bernád

In fact, a total of eleven I.A.R. 80 fighter pilots were killed that bloody day in clashes with 31st F.G. Mustangs, and a further six pilots wounded, as follows:
Gr. 1 vân.: 5+2,
Gr. 2 vân.: 2+4,
Gr. 6 vân.: 4+0
There were further combat losses suffered by ARR fighter pilots...



I don't know what source you may call "more generic"; however, details were included in my book on Rumanian aces, published by Osprey in 2003.

Thanks Denes; my 'more generic' sources were: Neulen's "In the Skys above Europe" & YOUR Osprey title---turns out I didn't read your book VERY closely...OOOPS, sorry MY bad...

NickM