Heinkel He177 Eger-Cheb Production

[schwarze-man]

Originally Posted by EduardosNormalos

Hi Schwarze,

And thanks a lot!

So, the total DB610 output would be as follows:

Year-DBGen-Bussing-Total
1942-1088-241-1329
1943-1734-425-2159
1944-2188-445-2633
Total-5010-1111-6121

This would be good for ~3000 He177's (without reservation for any spares), and for over 2000 a/c with 1/3rd reservation for spares. At least for me, this seems to be somewhat too much.

As for the Bussing numbers, they come from one of the USSBS -reports and are for the amount of coupled DB605-units (that is DB610-units). I wonder if the BIOS-report counts are for the DB605's allocated for the DB610 -units, and thus should be actually divided by two?
That would give roughly 3000 engines, which would be good for roughly 1000 a/c (which was the amount of DB610-engined A-3's and A-5's) with 1/3rd reservation for spares. Any thoughts on this?

Cheers,
Juha

Hi Juha!

The BIOS report was compiled from DB records at Unterturkheim. They refer to the DB610 specifically as "610=2x605 coupled". I would expect that the figures quoted are exactly as recorded by DB. The other figures for the 610 production are Niedersachsische Motorenwerke: 1942-482, 1943-850, 1944-970.
That gives totals:
1942-1570, 1943-2584, 1944-3158. Grand total, 7,312.

I guess a review of the actual DB archiv would be one way to try and confirm the record.
Best wishes,
SM

[EduardosNormalos]

Hi Schwarze,

Thanks for the additional data.

But, here I noticed something odd...

The Bussing (NAG) factory is actually the very same as Niedersächsische Motorenwerke GmbH:
https://www.deutsche-digitale-biblio...VSVRT766GXMIHH

Here it also says Bussing (or Niedersächsische MW) produced a total of 15.872 aero-engines between 1939 and 1944:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nieder...e_Motorenwerke

This total is also verified by the USSBS -report, that I have. And there the DB610 -numbers are "halved" from the DB605 -numbers, see:

Your data shows for the Nied.MW:
1942-482
1943-850
1944-970

These are exactly "doubles" to my data on Bussing (from the ultra-detailed USSBS), except for the last year. But you see the pattern:
1942-241
1943-425
1944-445

Best Regards,
Juha

[schwarze-man]

Hi Juha!
I have carefully listed the name and the numbers exactly how they are recorded in the BIOS report to avoid confusion. There is not an exact "doubling", the 1944-445 doubles as 890, not the 970 but, the other figures are spot-on. I am not able to shed more light on this. However, I know the two component engines in the DB610 are listed as the 605W and 605X. It would be interesting to know how the DB610 production was accounted. I expect that the 605 component engines would have had separate identities (werke-nummer) but, the DB610-as a completed unit- would surely have also had its own werke-nummer. Sorry I don't have better information on this.
Best wishes
SM

[edwest2]

I have found a book that may help.

NMW Braunschweig - Niedersächsische Motorenwerke GmbH Braunschweig-Querum. Büssing NAG. by Fischer, E.

Archive of the city of Salzgitter, 1st edition 2012. 216 pages, Unz. Fig., Hardcover, very good condition, 21.5 x 30.5 cm.
Contents: The aeronautical defense industry, the founding and legal forms of Niedersächsische Motorenwerke GmbH, the development of the plant, the structural development of plant facilities, the description of the Kameradschaftshaus, the buildings from 1992 to 1995, the workforce and vocational training, the workforce from 1935 to 1939 , The workforce from 1939 to 1945, The workforce from 1945 until the dissolution of the factory, The use of foreign labor, Foreign labor camps, Housing for the workforce, Vocational training, Military students / apprentices, Products and production, Aircraft engine construction 1938, The production before the Second World War, The products during the Second World War, The production program, BMW Aircraft engines, Junkers aircraft engines, Daimler-Benz aircraft engines, The production process, The production in the financial years 1936 to 1946, The Lower Saxony Gerätebaugesellschaft, later BÜSSING-NAG Entwicklungs GmbH, Die Transportgesellschaft mbH, The cooperation with the Technical University in Braunschweig, Conclusion and summary, chronology of the work, Annex, company regulations, table staff structure, references and bibliographical references, illustration proof, list of abbreviations

[Snautzer]

Usaaf bombing survey Volume 15 - Bussing NAG Flugmotorenwerke GmbH, Brunswick, Germany (for those who do not have this info)


.

[edwest2]

Snautzer,


Are there any references you don't have ?

[Snautzer]

I am a bit af a horder, i am afraid ;-)

[schwarze-man]

Snautzer,
Yes, very nice. Seems to be the same data but with more detail. Particularly interesting 1945 DB605 production detail. I must say, regarding the DB610 production, I assume that the recorded number of engines delivered must surely imply the number of complete double-engines, the heading says "double engine". The 610 was regarded as a single engine unit. Thanks for the post! Do you by any chance have the records for the other DB producing factories in 1945? I would dearly like to update the engine production till May 1945.
Best wishes

SM

[Snautzer]

Index to records of the United States Strategic Bombing survey. http://cgsc.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/r...3coll8/id/4100

look for SECTION 1. EUROPEAN DOCUMENTS gives a list of files that could be of intrest to you. Pdf is searchable (hit control F for search window)


Also look for possibly lightly related files here: http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu...mbing%20survey especially the oil report



I have these:

1. Interview - Henschel, Oscar May 1945
2. Interview - Messerschmitt, Professor May 1945
3. Interview Kurt Tank May 1945
4. Volume 10 - Focke Wulf Aircraft Plant, Bremen, Germany
5. Volume 14 - Wiener Neustaedter Flugzeugwerke Wiener Neustadt AustriaWiener Neustaedter Flugzeugwerke Wiener Neustadt Austria
6. Volume 15 - Bussing NAG Flugmotorenwerke GmbH, Brunswick, Germany
7. Volume 17 - Bavarian Motor Works, Inc, Eisenach & Durrerhof
8. Volume 18 - Bayerische Motorenwerke AG (BMW), Munich, Germany
9. Volume 6 - Junkers Aircraft and Aero Engine Works, Dessau, Germany
10. Volume 8 - ATG Maschinenbau, GmbH, Leipzig, (Mochau), Germany
11. Volume 9 - Gothaer Waggonfabrik, AG, Gotha, Germany

Only the Bussing NAG Flugmotorenwerke GmbH mentions DB engines Other aero engines are mentioned in a few af the reports.

[schwarze-man]

Snautzer,
Thank you for the link! I shall try to trawl it!
Best wishes

SM`