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  #11  
Old 8th February 2020, 23:04
Alex Smart Alex Smart is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Quote:
Originally Posted by edwest2 View Post
Hello Alex,


Do you have this book?


https://www.amazon.com/23rd-Fighter-.../dp/1846034213


Best,
Ed
No Ed, but will put it on my very long wish list
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  #12  
Old 8th February 2020, 23:10
edwest2 edwest2 is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Alas, this reminds me of my very long wish list... which just keeps getting longer.
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  #13  
Old 8th February 2020, 23:23
Frank Olynyk Frank Olynyk is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Franek,

I certainly know of cases of missing aircrew which are not covered by a MACR. During the invasion of Southern France, 5 or 6 Tuskegee fighter pilots of the 332nd FG were shot down, missing, killed or POW. There is only one MACR for these losses. I suspect the dreaded "lost in the mail" response. The MACRs were prepared by the missing aircrewman's squadron or group, and the MACR form and the witness reports were then (air) mailed to Washington, where they were assigned numbers and collected. If the aircraft with the MACRs crashed, or the mail bag was dropped into the sea at some point, then "lost in the mail." I have never seen a response from Washington back to the issuing unit that their MACRs had arrived in Washington. So the issuing unit had no way of knowing that they needed to prepare a new copy.

Enjoy!

Frank.
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  #14  
Old 8th February 2020, 23:46
Franek Grabowski Franek Grabowski is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Frank
A weird coincidence - I have just looked at MACR 11970 - last pages contain correspondence concerning MACRs missing in transit!
I do not know if the reason is in the missing reports or if for some reason they were not filed. It is my recollection, that some of the 1943 period were missing. Certainly the distance and the Hump prevented regular deliveries of paperwork. One of the most interesting papers that I have seen was a Flight Schedule for 75th, but I do not know if it was from the archives or kept by a pilot. Well, the hope is, that the paperwork was not properly destroyed, and still resides in some Chinese archive.
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  #15  
Old 10th February 2020, 14:21
Håkan Håkan is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Some nitpicking…

I think:
44/05/26 - P40N - 42-105002 - 75FS - 1Lt. SMEDLEY, W, R - O-810910 - 5809.
should be:
44/05/26 - P40N - 42-105002 - 75FS - 1Lt. SMEDLEY, W, R - O-801910 - 5809.

Best wishes/Håkan
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  #16  
Old 11th February 2020, 04:33
Alex Smart Alex Smart is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Thank you, my typo error, it is as you say O-801910. Now corrected.
Alex
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  #17  
Old 12th February 2020, 01:25
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: 23rd Fighter Group losses

Hello Alex, just wondering if you want to have the full loss list (or as much as possible) for 23rd FG, or if you are interested only in MACR.

The book "Sharks over China" had 6 pages (281-286) listing men of 23rd FG who died during WWII. KIA, KIFA, killed by Japanese bombs.

Just for the beginning of 1943, before the loss you list on 8 April (that is also in the book)
43/01/12 P-40 (no serial) 16th FS 1st Lt L F "Chip" Myers KIFA en route to Yunnanyi
43/01/16 P-40 (no serial) 16th FS 2nd Lt George V Pyles KIA Yunnanyi
43/02/11 P-40K-1 (no serial) 75th FS Lt William T Cross KIA strafing troops Nan Sang bridge
43/03/19 P-40 (no serial) 74th FS Capt Raymond W Lucia KIA ground fire near Mangshih
43/03/29 P-40 (no serial) 74th FS 1st Lt Robert E Atkinson KIA strafing Chefang
43/04/01 P-40K-1 41-5567 75th FS Capt Burrall Barnum KIA dogfight Lingling

Other losses where pilot survived are given in the narrative.

Before 1943, 16 pilots died in 1942 (8 KIA, 8 KIFA).

You can also check the list of accidents in https://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/AFrptsMO.htm.
For the same period as above, I found three total losses, including the one on 8 April 1943:
430313 P-40K 42-9926 76FS 23FG 10 LAC 4 Vaughn, Clyde C CHI Kunming
430324 P-40K 42-9921 75FS 23FG 14 BOF 5 Grosvenor, William (NMI) Jr CHI Kunming
430408 P-40K 42-46248 74FS 23FG 10 KCRF 5 Mitchell, David M IND New Delhi
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