loss 61 Sqn Lancaster W5000 2-3 August 1943

[Theo Boiten]

Dear all,

I have read several mentions that 61 Squadron Lancaster W5000 crashed in wet meadows at Daensen near Buxtehude on 2-3 August 1943. Is this crash location officially accepted by the British and German authorities, and is there any German (local) wartime record that confirm the crash location, a time of the crash and possibly also a cause of loss? I must say that I have no Flak or NJ claim for a bomber shot down at this location on 2/3.8.1943.

Cheers, Theo

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Theo

Perhaps this leads to someone who has that answer:

http://www.tageblatt.de/lokales/aktu...d,1254052.html

Greetz, Marcel

[Theo Boiten]

Hi Marcel,

Thanks for the link -this is one of the sources that I found last week during my search for info on W5000, it did provide me with quite some information but this also led to the questions that I raised in my posting.

Cheers, Theo

[GKPadu]

Hello Theo,
here some reports from Luftgaukommando XI:
1. "Abschüsse in der Nacht vom 2./3.8.1943 (Stand 3.8.43, 16.45 Uhr"
......
e) 2km westlich Daensen, nördlich Moisburg

2. "Meldung der gesamten Abschüsse für den Monat August 1943.
1. 3.8.43 02.02 Uhr 1 Feindflugzeug Flak 2km östlich Nindorf

3. "3. August 1943, 2km ostwärts Nindorf
1.u.3./schw. Flak-Abt. 603 (v) (Großb. Neuland)
4./schw. Flak-Abt. 603 (v)
4./schw. Flak-Abt. 306 (Großb. Eißendorf)
4./schw. Flak-Abt. 185 ( - " _ - " - )
4./schw. Flak-Abt. 227 (Eisb.)

3. Flakdivision"

The crash site is located between the villages of Daensen and Nindorf
at the river Este. There is no doubt. It is Lancaster W5000. We found a part of the MG Browning 303. It was painted with "Out 5000 W".
Parts with R3, and parts from a merlin engine Lancaster III. All other
crashed Lancaster III have confirmed crash sites and crews are buried on
different cemeteries.
A more detailed investigation report are available.

GKPadu

[Theo Boiten]

Hello and good evening GKPadu,

Many thanks for posting this convincing evidence re. the loss of W5000, I will send you a PM!

Beste Grüsse, Theo

[Rottler]

Hello,

in the German loss report is noticed:
3 Aug 43 0205 Lancaster Nindorf bei Apensen, Abschuß-Nr. KE 6268.
This is documented in the MACR list for August 1943.

Regards
Leo Rottler

[Rottler]

Hello Theo,

apart from the precisely informations in the reports from Luftgaukommando XI in the MACR list for August 1943 is a reference to a German loss report and the Abschussnummer:
"3 Aug 1943 Lancaster 0205 nahe Nindorf bei Apensen KE 6268".

Regards
Leo

[Theo Boiten]

Thanks Leo for these additional details.

Cheers, Theo

Hello Theo. I am responsible for stating that W 5000 has been found. I started the investigation back in 2013 along with a German guy, Dieter Pintatis. The crash site is identified beyond reasonable doubt. The German authorities accept that it is W5000 but the RAF were not interested. You can see for yourself via the internet what has happened over time. We have deliberately kept the location unclear so as not to provoke a person with a JCB. If you woul like more details on the story get in touch with me by any means you prefer. To tell the whole story would be best to speak but I will answer any questions via the forum or private message

Best wishes
Tony Clifford (nephew of Sgt Benjamin Robinson)

[Jabo]

Hello together,

I have dealt with the losses of 03.08.1943 without any other opinions.
In an process of elemination three crashsites were left.

Hatzte - County Rotenburg / Wuemme - Halifax
2 km east Niendorf - County Stade - unknown aircraft
3 km west Apensen - County Stade - Halifax

I can´t find any aircraft wich match Hatzte and Apensen. And I´m not sure that W5000 crashed between Niendorf and Deansen.

There is a handwritten note on one Luftgau-paper which states that 2 km west of Deansen a Halifax crashed with five "Engländer" (english People) killed, two badly wounded, one slightly wounded. So probably a eight men crew. The crassite which Tony discriped is approx. 2 km west of Deansen.

Kind Regards
Jens-Michael