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Old 12th December 2017, 20:11
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Herbert Lutje Claims IV./NJG 6

Herbert Lutje IV./NJG 6 claimed from his Romanian Base between June 10 through Mid Aug 1944 several planes ( see beneath ) the Wikipedia .....any
idea about the the dates when the Wellingtons and the IL 4 were shot down ?

Fighting the 15 AF he shot down two P 38's—one of them by his radio operator with the on 10 June 1944. His BF -110G (Werknummer 140018—factory number) was severely damaged. He and his wireless radio operator Obfwb .Bogumil were wounded and had to make a forced landing. Over Romania Lütje was credited with 6 Wellingtons bombers and one Soviet IL-4 reconnaissance aircraft over the Black Sea neat Constanza during nocturnal combat missions.
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Old 12th December 2017, 20:33
edwest2 edwest2 is online now
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Re: Herbert Lutje Claims IV./NJG 6

http://www.luftwaffe.cz/lutje.html





Hope this helps,
Ed
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Old 12th December 2017, 22:59
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Re: Herbert Lutje Claims IV./NJG 6

Ed thanks for your feedback...the claims of Lutje can't be verified very well

The Wellington claimed as of May 6,44 I did locate , the one of May 7,44
claimed NE of Cluj Napoca seems to be one of the two Wellingtons which
both were lost far South near Bucharest as such could not verify .

The two P-38's lost on June 10,44 possibly those of 1st FG are impossible to
be located due numerous other Luftwaffe and Romanian claims .In addition
he claimed a Wellington on 29.6.44 in Austria while stationed in Romania which
does not make any sense .

As into the Russian DB-3F claimed over the Black Sea this must have been
his Wellington claimed on 20.8.44 . On night 9/10 Aug 3 , 44 3 x Wellingtons were lost on
various locations in Romania as such unable to locate this claim either .

Thanks for your help

Last edited by researcher111; 12th December 2017 at 23:48.
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Old 13th December 2017, 13:56
Laurent Rizzotti Laurent Rizzotti is offline
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Re: Herbert Lutje Claims IV./NJG 6

According to the book "La chasse de nuit germano-roumaine 1943-1944", by Jean-Louis Roba and Cristian Craciunoiu, completed by the book "Luftwaffe night-fighter combat claims 1939-1945" by Foreman, Matthews and Parry

Night of 5-6 May 1944: one NJG claim and one RAF loss
33 6.5.1944 1:05 Wellington NW Ploesti
Wellington LP191 of 40 Sqn RAF (5 KIA)

Night of 7-8 May 1944: seven NJG claims (5 for Wellingtons) and six RAF losses (4 Wellingtons)
34 7.5.1944 23:59 Wellington IV./NJG 6 Maroshéviz
35 8.5.1944 0:18 Wellington IV./NJG 6 SW Blejesti
Note: Roba has the fist claim (34th) on the night of 6-7 May 1944, where the RAF lost 4 bombers for three known NJG claims

10 June 1944: 22 P-38 lost against 21 claims by Luftwaffe and 23 by Romanian fighters (+ possible Flak claims)
36 10.6.1944 8:29 P-38 IV./NJG 6 S Bucharest
37 10.6.1944 8:31 P-38 IV./NJG 6 S Bucharest / Shot down by Lütje’s crewman

Night of 28-29 June 1944: two NJG claims (one for a Wellington) and five RAF losses (one Wellington)
38 29.6.1944 2:23 Wellington IV./NJG 6 N Stockerau
Details of claims in Tony Wood files:
29.06.44 Fw. Hermann Scherer 11./NJG 6 Liberator  14 Ost N/AN-47: [S.W. Brunn] 02.17 Film C. 2027/II Anerk: Nr.4
29.06.44 Maj. Herbert Lütje Stab IV./NJG 6 Wellington  14 Ost N/BM-45: [N. Stockerau] 02.23 Film C. 2027/II Anerk: Nr.5
205 Group engaged 105 bombers against Romania, so I doubt there was a raid on Austria the same night, and so both NJG claims are probably over Romania (or nearby Bulgaria). Maybe the translation from 14 Ost NBM-45 into 'N Stockerau' is wrong, or it is the German name of a town in Rumania or Bulgaria.
So the victim of Lütje might be the Wellington MF194 of 70 Sqn RAF, that was shot down by a night-fighter and crasged near Svistof, Bulgaria. For a reason unknown to me, Roba says it could have been shot down by Scherer who claimed a Liberator (three lost that night, with a Halifax, all four-engined)

Night of 9-10 August 1944: four NJG claims (one for a Wellington) and 11 RAF losses (8 Wellingtons)
39 9.8.1944 23:00 Wellington IV./NJG 6 Rumania
Impossible to identify the victim of Lütje that night but certainly a confirmed kill

40 20.8.1944 23:05 Wellington IV./NJG 6 -
AFAIK no raid over Rumania on this night, the Foreman book has also this claim on this date but according to a file provided by Jim Perry, the smae claim was on the date of the 17 August in the KTB NJG 6 book by Koch (that I don't have)
Roba agrees with the night of 17-18 August 1944: it was the last RAF raid on Rumania and three Wellingtons were shot down. He gives Wellington LP327 of 40 Sqn as the possible victim of Lütje.

Missing on the link above is the 41st claim of Major Lütje, for a DB-3/Il-4 (both designation for same type of aircraft) at 0105 hrs on 22 August 1944, location unknown. Both Roba and Foreman and co agree on that. No identification provided.
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Old 15th December 2017, 00:27
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Re: Herbert Lutje Claims IV./NJG 6

Hi Laurent

Thank you for your feedback. It will take me a few days to verify his claims
I have the Roba book, 205GP History , 1st and 82nd FG's history books . That
wont be an easy task but I will try . Worth to mention in the meantime that
the Wellington near Maroshéviz at midnight does not make any sense , because
the Wellington never arrived that far nor Lutje would risk to fly near the Carpatian
peaks at night and eventually get caught into IMC conditions or down drafs . The DB-3F
claim on the night of 21/22 Aug 44 seems to exist as the Black Sea Fleet reported
the loss of a IL-4 near Constanza brought down by 8./NJG 6 . The both P-38 on
Bucharest area is also a difficult task because this claim is also shared by other
Luftwaffe pilots.
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