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  #1  
Old 6th November 2009, 21:56
tcolvin tcolvin is offline
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Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

I would be interested to know if anyone has identified the site where the 13 Stukas of i./St.G.76 led by Hauptmann Sigel (who survived) crashed on the range at Neuhammer, now in Poland. (51deg 28min N, 15deg 24min E).

Fooling around with Google Earth I found a group of holes west of Neuhammer, and marked the location on a 1937 aerial photograph published to the web by the Bundesarchiv.
The chances of this being the spot can be discounted, but it would be interesting to know if anyone has dug up the Stuka remains.

I notice my annotation of the 1937 photo has not come out; it should be just north of the second P in Truppen.

Tony
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Neuhammer stuka site.jpg (144.6 KB, 211 views)
File Type: jpg Stuka crash-site2.jpg (150.8 KB, 220 views)
File Type: jpg Bundesarchiv_Bild_196-04558,_Neuhammer_am_Quais.jpg (119.5 KB, 223 views)

Last edited by tcolvin; 6th November 2009 at 21:58. Reason: Clarity.
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Old 8th November 2009, 13:40
steve sheridan steve sheridan is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Hi Tony, can you supply any further information as to this tragedy.
I have not heard of this incident before. When did this happen?
Best regs,
Steve.
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Old 8th November 2009, 14:07
RT RT is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Seems that the Wn are partially known

Remi
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Old 8th November 2009, 15:15
tcolvin tcolvin is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Certainly Steve. The following is from various sources,

On August 15, 1939, I./St.G.76 led by Hauptmann Sigel and I./St.G.2"Immelmann" under Hauptmann Hitschold, were ordered to demonstrate dive-bombing on the Neuhammer range to Generals von Manstein, von Richthofen, Sperrle and Loerzer.
Over Neuhammer, which is at 137 metres elevation, it was 7/10 cloudy above 900 metres, but underneath it was clear. A ground mist suddenly developed but Gruppe was not informed. Sigel with his I./St.G.76, started their dive through cloud. At the last moment Sigel saw the danger, radioed a warning, and pulled up from close to the ground. But 13 Stukas with 26 crew members crashed without survivors. Eleven Stukas went straight in, while two hit the ground during pull-out. The Immelmann Gruppe saw the danger and returned to base.

Neuhammer, now called Świętoszów, is in the lower Silesian Voivodeship, 125 kms west of the regional capital, Wroclaw.

The German Army created a large training ground here in the 19th century. In WWI it was the site of a large Russian POW camp. In WWII Stalag VIII-E was built here for Polish and French prisoners. In 1942 they were replaced with Soviet prisoners, and the camp was placed under the administration of Stalag VIII-C near Żagań. At least 50,000 Soviet prisoners died here from disease, starvation and inhumane treatment, the last 200 of them killed as traitors after the war by the NKVD. It was a Red Army base until 1992, and today is occupied by the Polish Army.

Tony

Last edited by tcolvin; 8th November 2009 at 15:31. Reason: Corrected elevation.
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Old 10th November 2009, 08:18
steve sheridan steve sheridan is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Many thanks for the interesting story Tony.
What an absolute tragedy!

Remi, do you have on hand any W.Nr's known?

Kindest regs,
Steve.
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Old 10th November 2009, 08:41
edNorth edNorth is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Hi Steve, here goes.

Ju 87 B-1 0433 S1+BL
Ju 87 B-1 5177 S1+GL
Ju 87 B-1 5170 S1+CL
Ju 87 B-1 5172 S1+DL
Ju 87 B-1 5176 S1+FL
Ju 87 B-1 5168 S1+GK
Ju 87 B-1 0411 S1+AL
Ju 87 B-1 5202 S1+MK
Ju 87 B-1 5121 S1+KK
Ju 87 B-1 xxxx S1+BB (as "81BB" in document) 2 crew light injured but a/c. w/o
Ju 87 B-1 0403 S1+DK
Ju 87 B-1 5165 S1+FK

All other (22) crew killed, aircraft destroyed. Cause given as "Bodenebel" (ground fog), "absturz im Wald" (crashed in Forest). Yes, tragic indeed.

cheers
ed
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Old 10th November 2009, 12:43
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CJE CJE is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Yes, tragic indeed.

Maybe not for the Poles that would have been on the receiving end a fortnight later.
But that's a point of view.
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Old 10th November 2009, 15:24
tcolvin tcolvin is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

The chances are, surely, that the aircraft remains are still in situ.
The Germans would not have dug them up as the cause of loss was known, although they would have recovered the bodies I assume. The Russian and Polish armies probably knew/know nothing of these events, and wouldn't be interested if they did.

The immediate site is safe since the Stukas were carrying not HE but practice smoke bombs.
But the range itself will be covered in military detritus including live ordnance left over a period of 130+ years. It is bound to be a restricted area.

I seem to remember there's someone on this board reassembling a Stuka. If he's short of bits, this site would seem to be the place to dig if someone could remember where on the range they went in, and if the Polish Army would give permission.
That's a lot of 'ifs'.
One clue that could narrow the choice of crash-site location could be the 'absturz im Wald' mentioned by Ed North. I can't see any trees using Google Earth, although I haven't looked closely, but there would be records showing where trees were in 1939, and they might be visible on the original 1937 Neuhammer aerial photograph held by the BundesArchiv.

Tony
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Old 14th November 2009, 21:55
steve sheridan steve sheridan is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

Evening Ed, many thanks for the superb information on the a/c lost.

May i ask your source?
Are there any crew names mentioned.

Best regs,
Steve.
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Old 15th November 2009, 00:06
edNorth edNorth is offline
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Re: Crash-site location of 13 Stukas?

"Statitsche Zusammenstellung der Únfalle im Flugbetrieb des Jahres ...<month, year to month, year >.. nach flugmedizinschen Geschictspunten" (medical orianted statistical research lists) compiled by DVL Berlin-Adlershof (i.e. compiled in pre-war and wartime Germany for periods 01.1936 to 12.1942. As last months (07-12.1942) were compiled and issued and dated 06.06.44 I doupt more were done.

This usually giving (per month), code, type and general details of what happened, four catagories of injures to personnel, three catagories of damage to aircraft and in-quite-a-detail the injures sustained to each person/s - in rare cases only W.Nr. are given - unusually enought both in the case of the Ju 87´s. No names or units are included.

I do not have name of library or the reference number to these, but they apparently coming from some microfilm in the USA - Stamped "Unclassified" "Library Copy" (marked "UM645") - if that lights up any brains over there.
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