The opponents of Gert Framm, JG 27

[Nick Hector]

I had an enquiry about him elsewhere, thought I would share this here:

Gert Framm

1st and 2nd Claims
12.5.40/1030, 1035 and 1035
3 x Blenheim IVs
Maastricht
107 sqn, 4 losses this day: L8733/OM- of P/O S G Thornton and one other KIA 3rd crewman POW, L8748/OM-K of F/O R C Rotheram & crew all KIA, plus P4905/OM- of F/O W H Edwards and one other POW, 3rd crewman KIA and P4914 of P/O O H Keedwell and crew all KIA. Framm is generally credited with P4905

3rd Claim
12.5.40/1035
Hurricane I
Maastricht
This one said to be L1671 of 1 sqn. S/L P J H "Bull" Halahan safe. Aircraft bellylanded and abandoned.

4th Claim
16.5.40/1440
Hurricane I
Brussels
N2335 of 615 sqn. F/L L T W Thornley MIA

5th claim
23.5.40/1230
Spitfire I
Dunkirk
P9370 of 92 sqn. P/O Patrick Alexander George Learmond KIA

6th claim
1.6.40/0905
Blenheim IV ("Wellington")
Dunkirk
L9481/QY-A of 254 sqn. F/O J W Baird and Sgt. R Roskrow (of 48 sqn) both MIA-KIA, P/O G W Spiers safe

6th claim
1.6.40/0908
Blenheim IV ("Wellington")
Dunkirk
R3630/QY-Q of 254 sqn. Sgt. R A Bate, Sgt. J T Love and LAC W T Harrison all KIA

7th claim
6.6.40/1720
Potez 63
Opponent not traced

8th and 9th claims
13.6.40/1310 and 1315
2 x Curtiss Hawks
Montmirail – Chateauroux
GC III/2. Overclaiming No. 236 of SLt Lansoy forcelanded
(Emil Kaiser is credited with No. 264 of GC III/2. Adj-Chef Maurice Romey KIA)

10th claim
27.7.40/1045
Spitfire I
Weymouth Bay
N3023 of 609 "West Riding" sqn. P/O James Richebourg Buchanan KIA

[focusfocus]

Hi Nick

06/06/40

One of 10 Leo 451 shot down
GB II/12=3
GB II/22=1
GB I/11=4
GB II/31=1
GB II/23=1
Shared with I/JG51 (4 claims),I/JG1 (15 claims)

13/06/40

the two claims founded.
Fight against GC III/2(four losses)

Curtis n°247 (c/n 13717) crashed Montceaux-les Provins (77) Cdt Frederic Geille burned

Curtis n°236 (c/n 13706) crashed La Noue (77) Slt.Andre Lansoy wounded

Curtis n°264 (c/n 13734) crashed Chamguyon (51)

Curtis n°262 (c/n 13732) forced landing after fight Vaupoisson S/Lt Jacques Dartevelle.

One of the four by Erich Gerlitz (I/JG1) claims as Bloch.
Others 3 by Framm(2) and Kaiser 1)

Michel

[Nick Hector]

Thanks for the update, Michel!

[Bertrand H]

Not really important but the rank of Maurice Romey is Adjutant.
His nice biography written by Alain Coste is in the issue n°120 of Avions (2003)

Attachment 17496

Bertrand

[rledwards76]

Hi Nick,
In relation to L8748/OM-K of F/O R C Rotheram & crew all KIA, this is incorrect... I met Ronny Rotheram in England in 2000 and I can assure you he was well alive.
Obituary link below:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obi...-Rotheram.html
Regards, Ross Edwards (My Grandfather flew P4905)

[Nick Hector]

Originally Posted by rledwards76

Hi Nick,
In relation to L8748/OM-K of F/O R C Rotheram & crew all KIA, this is incorrect... I met Ronny Rotheram in England in 2000 and I can assure you he was well alive.
Obituary link below:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obi...-Rotheram.html
Regards, Ross Edwards (My Grandfather flew P4905)

Thanks, I re-checked sources. You're quite right. I appreciate the correction

[VtwinVince]

Claim 5 is very early for a Spitfire.

[Nick Hector]

Originally Posted by VtwinVince

Claim 5 is very early for a Spitfire.

Earliest legitimate claim I have found for a Spitfire was:

22.3.40/1245 by Harald Jung of 1./JG 20. His victim was Spitfire PR III
N3069 of PDU. P/O Claude Mervyn Wheatley, baled out but KIA when chute failed to open. Location given as 6km NW of Kleve/Dutch border, S of Arnhem

The first legitimate claims for fighter Spitfires occurred in the engagement between II./JG 26 and 66 Squadron (264 sqn Defiants also involved) on May 13th.

So yes, very early for a Spitfire but not impossibly so

[rof120]

Originally Posted by VtwinVince

Claim 5 is very early for a Spitfire.

It was possibly a Hurricane - we all know that both types very often were mixed up by German aircrew including fighter pilots. But it was possibly a Spitfire all right. The location at or near Dunkerque makes it possible. Operation "Dynamo" (the Dkq. troop evacuation over the sea) started first on 26 May but it's very possible that RAF fighters were prowling in the area before that date for everybody in England knew that about half a million retreating or surrounded troops (British plus French, Belgian, Polish) needed fighter protection.

The name of the dead RAF pilot being mentioned it should be possible to check on the fighter type he was flying.

(In the meantime I checked.) YES Norman LR Franks*) named precisely this pilot (92 Sqn) of Spitfire I P9370 on "patrol (along the) French coast, shot down in flames over Dunkirk by Me 109".
Franks gives a list of 9 Spitfires (74, 92, 54 Sqns) and 9 Hurricanes shot down that day in the same area - some by Me 110s, the rest by 109s.

*) See Frank's pale-blue booklet "Royal Air Force FIGHTER COMMAND LOSSES of the Second World War (...) Volume 1, page 30.
Published 1997.

[Chris Goss]

Ross: I was in touch with him not the family. He had very little apart from a few photos and I no longer have his address. He would be 106 next month...............