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  #11  
Old 20th February 2019, 11:44
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveM2 View Post
I am hoping one of those was lost on 15 March 1943?
I have been following this discussion with interest.
May I ask Dave why you state 15 March 1943?
According to both Mombeek and Valtonen no Bf 109 was lost what so ever on that particular date. I have not checked Prien, but I don't think he and his team has located any lost 109 either

GRM
I am interested in your statement that Oblt Bauer returned.
Mombeek says he was missing while Valtonen says he was killed.
Obviously you must rely on some other information stating that.
May I ask your source?

Cheers
Stig
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  #12  
Old 20th February 2019, 12:09
DaveM2 DaveM2 is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stig Jarlevik View Post
I have been following this discussion with interest.
May I ask Dave why you state 15 March 1943?
According to both Mombeek and Valtonen no Bf 109 was lost what so ever on that particular date. I have not checked Prien, but I don't think he and his team has located any lost 109 either

GRM
I am interested in your statement that Oblt Bauer returned.
Mombeek says he was missing while Valtonen says he was killed.
Obviously you must rely on some other information stating that.
May I ask your source?

Cheers
Stig
Stig

This came from the document describing the Safanovo collection 'Presumably shot down March 15, 1943 by Guard Captain PI. Orlov."
I think it was a 'ballpark' guess on their part, trying to fit it in with Orlov's claim.

The fighter came down on the frozen Yavr-ozero and eventually sank into shallow water. They Russians also say the pilot was picked up by Storch after making his way south toward Kandalakscha, which was apparently the only village in the vicinity at the time (even if some 200 km away). Hence the reference in the loss report.

Interesting case for sure!

cheers
Dave
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  #13  
Old 20th February 2019, 14:06
Matti Salonen Matti Salonen is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Bauer returned 6 April 1943 but was killed in France on 2 December 1943 with Fw 190 A-6, 531077, 2 weiße of 1./JGr. Süd.

Matti
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  #14  
Old 20th February 2019, 14:32
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Thanks Dave

So the recovery of Bauer is only from Soviet sources?
Is there any German source saying he returned?

The best way of finding out which aircraft it is must be to pinpoint the lake in question. Problem is that Yavr does not get us anywhere since (from Google) this seems to be a kind of "suffix" to various different lakes all ending with yavr and on top they all seems to be in the northern Murmansk area and not Alakurtti - Kandalaksja.
Ozero does not help either since that only means lake in Russian.

Can the complete name of the lake be tracked down?

Cheers
Stig
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  #15  
Old 20th February 2019, 14:36
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matti Salonen View Post
Bauer returned 6 April 1943 but was killed in France on 2 December 1943 with Fw 190 A-6, 531077, 2 weiße of 1./JGr. Süd.

Matti
Thanks Matti

Was hoping you would appear at some point.
While perhaps not your back pocket, you have helped me before with these tricky lakes. No idea I suppose which "Yavr" this could be?

Perhaps better to wait until Dave can get some further news from his sources.

Cheers
Stig
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  #16  
Old 20th February 2019, 15:06
Kari Lumppio Kari Lumppio is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stig Jarlevik View Post
..Yavr does not get us anywhere since (from Google) this seems to be a kind of "suffix" to various different lakes ...
"Yavr" is Sami word for lake (in Finnish "järvi").
Note therea are several Sami languages, lake can also be "javri" (https://www.freelang.net/online/sami.php?lg=gb). In Swedish maps for example one can see -jaur, too

Kari
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  #17  
Old 20th February 2019, 15:32
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Thanks Kari

Didn't know that...., well I know järvi of course but not any Sami words....

So we are now left with something which is called "Lake Lake" (Yavr Ozero).

Hey Dave

We need the real name of the lake where the aircraft was fished out of the water!

Cheers
Stig
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  #18  
Old 20th February 2019, 16:36
Matti Salonen Matti Salonen is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Yavrozero: 68 12 20 N, 29 58 34 E


Matti
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  #19  
Old 20th February 2019, 16:42
kirche kirche is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Uffz Krischkovski's Bf-109G-2 14658 - 3 km E from Domashnee lake (68.681596, 32.859178).
5 km NE from the same lake supposedly fell another Me-109, but 12.03.1943
Both planes fell into the forest and burned.
According to the source: http://www.airwar.ru/other/article/uson.html
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  #20  
Old 20th February 2019, 18:49
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: Bf109 G-2 wk.nr. 14666

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matti Salonen View Post
Yavrozero: 68 12 20 N, 29 58 34 E


Matti
Wow, thanks Matti

Called Ozero Yavrozero which then should mean Lake Lakelake (if translated)

This is in the middle of nowhere and the nearest Luftwaffe airfield would have been Vuotso, a rather small and unknown field, and basically used (I think) as a forward temporary one (absprungplatze).

Dave
Can you confirm this is the correct lake where the aircraft was found?)

Cheers
Stig
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