About Jagdwaffe V5S3 'Defending the Reich'

[O.Menu]

That's another very nice book but i would like to correct two captions:

# 1/ Fw 190F-8 'Yellow 11+-" (p287 & 288 ) is not from II./SG2 but from II./SG10


(skin from Julio Junqueira Brasil for 'European Air War' flight simulator)

Explanation:
On March 7th, 1945, an order issued from Kliegerkorps IV ask Luftflotte 4 (single engine only?) airplanes to show 'a yellow nose band + yellow rudder' instead of the previous 'yellow fuselage band + yellow underwing chevron' but at this time only I./SG2 and full SG10 unit were still under Luftflotte4 command.

Proof:
Fw 190 markings from II./SG2 are well known and without any yellow nose band > just see H.U.Rudel surrender there:
http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/kitzingen.htm

# 2/ Ta 152H 'Yellow 1+-" (p264) is very probably not from 7./JG301 but from 11./JG301

Simply because Ta 152 were only delivered to III./JG301 (and looking to the lost list probably only to 11th and 12th Staffel) before being transfered to the GeschwaderStab.

It seems that between December44 and Mars45 the horizontal bar was absolutely not specific from the II./JG301 (See my other post about 'JG301 late war markings': http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...ighlight=JG301 )

More information expected in forthcoming Fw 190D book from Jerry Crandall (Note i have absolutely no link with Mr Crandall)

[Nick Beale]

We know that Fliegerkorps IV. issued the order about using the yellow cowl band and rudder. We don't know how many other formations got the same order do we? Can anyone confirm that it was just within Luftflotte 4 or is that an educated guess?

[O.Menu]

You are perfectly right Nick, In "Hungarian Eagles - from Hikoki Publication" Georges Punka just say the Fliegerkorps IV order for yellow nose band + yellow rudder superdeded the previous order for all airplanes flying over Hungary to have a yellow chevron under the wing + yellow fuselage band.

Anyway if we look to April 9th, 1945, Luftflotte4 order of Battle, near all his single engine units are known for sure to used the yellow nose band:
- NAGr.14 > yes > Barry Rosch p134 and monogram close up Bf 109G part2
- SG 10 > yes > J.Manrho "Bodenplatte" p46 show Hptm H.Stollnberger in front a yellow nosed Fw 190 after his transfert to 8./SG10
- I./SG2 > very probably yes but it's impossible to make the difference with I./SG10
- NSGr.5 > to find
- 2./NSGr.10 > yes > Barry Rosch p77
- Stab/JG76 > to find (will be hard only very few airplanes)
- II./JG51 > to find (will be also hard to find since disbanded on April 12th)
- II./JG52 > Yes > very well known
- I./JG53 > Yes > JG53 Vol III from G.Prien
- Ung.SGr > Yes > Hungarian Eagles (text only ) - (cant yet remember where i saw a photo)
- Ung.JG1 > Yes > Hungarian Eagles, Denes web site...
- Kroatish Bf 109 > Yes > Sq signal publication

On the other way the only none Luftflotte 4 airplane i know with both yellow nose band and yellow rudder is a Bf 109 white9 (Sq Signal pub) claimed to be from JG 11 since a yellow fuselage band is also visible. But since this yellow fuselage band was previous Luftflotte4 markings you perfectly understood that it's very difficult to know if this aircraft is from JG11 or not. (Many yellow nosed airplanes continue to show their previous underwing chevron marking, but i agree the yellow fuselage was usualy overpainted)
Could someone with Prien's book 'Jagdgeschwader 1 und 11, Teil 3, 1944-1945' tell us if there any other JG11 Bf 109 showing a yellow nose band with yellow rudder?

And did any of you know any other proof from a non Luftflotte4 unit using the yellow nose ring + yellow rudder?

[edwest]

This link mentions a book that includes information about Luftflotte 4 in Romania. I've never heard of it:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/2072/LF4.html




Usual disclaimer,
Ed

[Dénes Bernád]

If you're referring to: Kissel, Hans. Die Katastrophe in Rumänien 1944 , it's an old book. I only have a xerox copy of it.

None of the marking changes described above was in effect at the time of the Rumania's about-face of Aug. 1944.

[edwest]

Thank you,


Ed