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  #1  
Old 21st October 2013, 17:39
Harrie Harrie is offline
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Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

Hello all,

On 7-8-1943 Bf110 -D3 werknr 3686 is lost in Vlagtwedde [holland]
It was from 1/njg3 and had engine-trouble.
Is there anymore information about the crew ? and the crash location.?
The version D3 is somewhere early type ,thought they made more G2 and G4 that period or maybe survivor of the early days.

Any help will be appreciated

Best regards harrie
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Old 22nd October 2013, 00:37
Jim P. Jim P. is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

The date was actually 7-Aug-42. Previously flown by Alfred Warrelmann. The Ries source lists another pilot as I recall, but the 8 claims on the tail match Warrelmann's.

Bf 110D-3, 3686, Warrelmann, Fw. Alfred, 8, I., 3., NJG 3, , L1+IL, CC+MP, 8 victories on tail, including 4 Polish., , Spring 1941?, , Deutschland? Sicily?, Ries, Rudder Markings, p.82; Held/Nauroth, The Defense of the Reich, p.105, 109 photos., Mankau/Petrick, Messerschmitt Bf 110, Me 210 & Me 410, p.324, , -, F, , , MIAG at Braunschweig in Oct-40
Bf 110D-3, 3686, n.n., , I., , NJG 3, , , CC+MP, , 07-Aug-42, Crashed due to engine trouble. Crew FSA., Non-combat flight 'H', 7-Aug-43 per Balss, incorrect based on Gen.Qu. volume., Lw.Bfh.Mitte/Nachtjagd, Gen.Qu.6.Abt. (mfm #6)-Vol.10; Balss, Deutsche Nachtjagd, II, p.179, Mankau/Petrick, Messerschmitt Bf 110, Me 210 & Me 410, p.324, Vlachtwedde, 100%, F, , , MIAG at Braunschweig in Oct-40

Last edited by Jim P.; 22nd October 2013 at 00:37. Reason: fix
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Old 22nd October 2013, 16:28
Harrie Harrie is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

Hello Jim,

Thanks for the reaction!, correct my if am wrong but in the Verlieslijst [lostlist database holland ] is 7-8-1943 mentioned . Don,t know the reason ,see also a7-8-1942 and a 7-8-1943 in your rapport . 100% bruch .Are you 100% sure it,s 1942 instead 1943?
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Old 23rd October 2013, 00:17
Jim P. Jim P. is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

This source - Gen.Qu.6.Abt. (mfm #6)-Vol.10 - are loss records from 1942. 1943 doesn't start until microfilm #8. Microfilm contents by volume listed below.


Roll 1 Volume 1 - 1.9.39 to 2.1.40, Volume 2 - 3.1.40 to 2.9.40
Roll 2 Volume 3 - 3.9.40 to 2.1.41
Roll 3 Volume 4 - 3.1.41 to 2.6.41, Volume 5 - 3.6.41 to 2.8.41
Roll 4 Volume 6 - 3.8.41 to 2.11.41, Volume 7 - 3.11.41 to 2.2.42
Roll 5 Volume 8 - 3.2.42 to 2.5.42
Roll 6 Volume 9 - 3.5.42 to 2.7.42, Volume 10 - 3.7.42 to 26.8.42
Roll 7 Volume 11 - 27.8.42 to 2.11.42, Volume 12 - 3.11.42 to 2.1.43
Roll 8 Volume 13 - 3.1.43 to 2.2.43, Volume 14 - 3.2.43 to 2.3.43
Roll 9 Volume 15 - 3.3.43 to 2.4.43, Volume 16 - 3.4.43 to 2.5.43
Roll 10 Volume 17 - 3.5.43 to 2.6.43, Volume 18 - 3.6.43 to 2.7.43,
Roll 11 Volume 19 - 3.7.43 to 2.8.43, Volume 20 - 3.8.43 to 2.9.43, Volume 21 - 3.9.43 to 2.10.43, Volume 22 - 3.10.43 to 2.11.43
Roll 12 Volume 23 - 3.11.43 to 2.12.43, Volume 24 - 3.12.43 to 2.1.44

Last edited by Jim P.; 23rd October 2013 at 00:27. Reason: clarity
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Old 23rd October 2013, 13:53
Harrie Harrie is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

Helllo Jim,

Nice to see there,s info on the microfilm for the losses,but how can i read them ?
Sorry am not familair with the use of these films .
Can i look them on the internet ? .
Also trying to make appointment to see local police report from 7-8-43 or the other version 1942 . The plane is nearby my town crashed ,if location is known ,probably field-research job. Trying to find out who was the pilot if not Fw Warrelmann.

Regards harrie
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Old 23rd October 2013, 14:56
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Jaap Woortman Jaap Woortman is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

Harrie,

Here page 9 from Genst.gen.Qu. 6.Abt. nr. 5700/42 g.Kdos.(IC) from H.Q. 12.8.1942. See number 141.
Seeing it is believing it.
Where the one year difference is coming from, I do not know.
I will send a message to SGLO.

Jaap

Last edited by Jaap Woortman; 27th January 2018 at 11:45.
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  #7  
Old 24th October 2013, 00:41
Jim P. Jim P. is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

The films are available for sale from the PRO in the UK as microfilm and from the Bundesarchiv as fiche (I believe). I don't think they are posted anywhere on the net except as individual page postings in answer to inquiries such as from Jaap.
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Old 24th October 2013, 11:56
Harrie Harrie is offline
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Re: Bf-110 D3 werknr 3686 1/NJG3

Jim and Jaap,

No doubt about ! Seeing it and i believe it .
To Jim thanks for your help about the Bundesarchiv and page Genst.gen.Qo.
Nice to have those microfilms .
To Jaap, thanks for the page ! ,the SGLO can make a date chance now.
I try to look at the local police-report of 1942 if further information about crew-names is given and location .
Whenever having more info i will contact you both.

Thanks harrie

Regards harrie
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