Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum  

Go Back   Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum > Discussion > Japanese and Allied Air Forces in the Far East

Japanese and Allied Air Forces in the Far East Please use this forum to discuss the Air War in the Far East.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 13th August 2017, 07:07
kaki3152 kaki3152 is online now
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,839
kaki3152 is an unknown quantity at this point
F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Found this picture on the Web and found it very interesting.

Can anyone identify? It probably dates from 1945,based on insignia and camouflage.

Last edited by kaki3152; 15th September 2017 at 06:22.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 13th August 2017, 14:53
twocee twocee is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 380
twocee is on a distinguished road
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

F4U-4, 81473, of VMF211 on 16 February 1950. The pilot took off from USS Saipan with the left wing not locked. Fatal.
__________________
George Kernahan
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 13th August 2017, 20:06
kaki3152 kaki3152 is online now
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,839
kaki3152 is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Thanks George, the F4U was not known as the "Ensign Eliminator" for nothing
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 13th August 2017, 20:31
twocee twocee is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 380
twocee is on a distinguished road
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaki3152 View Post
Thanks George, the F4U was not known as the "Ensign Eliminator" for nothing

I think that "Ensign Eliminator" meant that a lot of trainees on the aircraft had difficulty in mastering it. However, because the aircraft was very strong the number of fatalities was relatively low.

The loss in the photo was simple pilot error.
__________________
George Kernahan
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 14th August 2017, 22:20
kaki3152 kaki3152 is online now
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,839
kaki3152 is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Well, although that is somewhat true, I believe the picture is a little mixed. The F4U Corsair killed many pilots, both ensigns and higher ranks in flight accidents.
As late as January 1945, the F4U was considered inferior to the F6F Hellcat as a overall carrier fighter. One problem was its stall characteristics:
"The F4U stalls easily at low speeds without any advance warning, such as the shuddering felt in a F6F, and tends to fall off on either wing ...For this reason two planes were lost just after takeoff and another while making its final turn to come aboard."

Here is a more detailed explanation for this accident. Notice the caption says "folds when a lock gives way". This means the ground crew verified that the wing lock was properly configured at takeoff. I'd hate to blame the pilot for a mechanical failure.

:Here on the 16th of February 1950, a Corsair is launched from the American carrier USS Saipan during operations off the coast of Korea. Immediately after catapulting from the deck, the Corsair's wing folds when a lock gives way. The result were catastrophic as the sequence of four photos reveals (I'll spare you those). The pilot, Lt Loren Grover, could do absolutely nothing to prevent his death. As Corsair operators, it is a sobering lesson to all of us that the unimaginable can happen... at any time. Photo via USS Saipan website.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 7th September 2017, 20:58
Leendert Leendert is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 2,728
Leendert will become famous soon enough
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Kaki,

The regrettable accident with Lt Grover must have happened not off Korea, but off the American East Coast. USS Saipan was operating there from Nov 1949 till March 1951.

Regards,

Leendert
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 7th September 2017, 21:17
twocee twocee is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 380
twocee is on a distinguished road
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Far from Korea---37.15N:75.08W.
__________________
George Kernahan
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 7th September 2017, 23:29
Revi16 Revi16 is online now
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,313
Revi16 is on a distinguished road
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaki3152 View Post
Well, although that is somewhat true, I believe the picture is a little mixed. The F4U Corsair killed many pilots, both ensigns and higher ranks in flight accidents.
As late as January 1945, the F4U was considered inferior to the F6F Hellcat as a overall carrier fighter. One problem was its stall characteristics:
"The F4U stalls easily at low speeds without any advance warning, such as the shuddering felt in a F6F, and tends to fall off on either wing ...For this reason two planes were lost just after takeoff and another while making its final turn to come aboard."
And yet, the US Navy & Marine Corps chose to keep the Corsair in service until the mid-fifties while retiring Hellcats from front line service very shortly after the war.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 8th September 2017, 00:10
twocee twocee is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 380
twocee is on a distinguished road
Re: F4U Takeoff Crash-Wings folded

The Corsair was superior to the Hellcat, both as a fighter and as a bomber.

After WWII many of the surviving Hellcats were converted into pilotless drones and used as targets, which is why so few survive today as so-called warbirds.
__________________
George Kernahan
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[Study] November 23, 1939 : Luftwaffe losses / crash sites over France (I need your help !) DIscotraxxx Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 18 21st October 2013 23:49
Update:107 Plane crash in WWII, 30 km around of Heidelberg Area Part 1 Klaus Deschner Allied and Soviet Air Forces 4 15th August 2013 04:27
Incomplete loss information Jim P. Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces 11 7th November 2011 01:33
Links Relating To Aircraft Incidents RossGmann General 0 25th April 2008 15:07


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 19:27.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net