Tony Wood's Luftwaffe Eastern front list oddities

[kaki3152]

While going through Tony Wood's Eastern front LW victory claims, I came accross some strange claims. I'd like to post them for comments.

May 31,1944 2/(F)100 Obfhr. Rumpf Thunderbolt 30km S. Polomoye 8300m

July15,1944 2./NAGr 2 Ltn Brutt Mustang 50 82 @ 3600m
Juky 15,1944 2/NAGr 2 Ltn Kruse P-2 (Pe-2?) 50 82 @ 3000m
July 15,1944 2/NAGr 2 Fw. Strobach P-51 Mustang 50 17 @ 3000m
July 15,1944 2/NAGr 2 Uffz Eisenhardt P-51 Mustang 50 61 @ 4000m


Sept. 25,1944 3./SG 121(?) Gefr. Naumann Bf-109 38 846 @3500m

Nov 7,1944 1./NAGr 12 (Eins) Lt Haus & Uffz Voss Wellington
NW Butnir 2000M (WSW Sarajevo)

Hopefully someone will know more about these victory claims.

[mhuxt]

July 15 sounds like Ploesti, September 25 sounds like a Bulgarian 109, Wellington might be 205 Group, seems a bit late for Wellingtons though, maybe an SOE craft, or something from the Balkan Air Force, 37 Squadron perhaps.

Have a look here:

http://natureonline.com/37/42-op31.html

Wellingtons of 37 Squadron went to Sarajevo on 7 November 1944, (along with 77 other aircraft) losing 1 in Wellington action and another on return.

[kaki3152]

I don't think the July 15th claims are from Ploesti. I do appreciate the information on the 37sq Wellington.

[Nick Beale]

"SG 121" could be SG 151, which had various elements in the Balkans in 1944. Some of them had Fw 190 F-models, so they had air-to-air potential.

NAG 12 had a whole variety of Bf 109 G sub-types, so again they could fight if required.

[Jim P.]

As I recall Tony said a lot of these claims were transcribed from handwritten documents, likely leading to some error in trying to interpret these things.

[Csaba B. Stenge]

NAGr. 2 and NAGr. 12 had a number of claims, since they flew Gustavs, as Nick pointed out. I have a number of Nahaufklärung claims in details from Freiburg (including Ltn. Brütt's, which was not in the Ploiesti area, of course, since they stationed far from it).

Need to check the PlQ but 25 Sept sounds rather a Rumanian Messerschmitt (over Transylvania).

[Dénes Bernád]

Originally Posted by Csaba B. Stenge

...25 Sept sounds rather a Rumanian Messerschmitt (over Transylvania).

On 25 Sept. 1944, only one ARR Bf 109G-6 was lost, to the rear gunner of a Ju 188 near Kolozsvar/Cluj/Klausenburg, Transylvania.

By the way, can anyone confirm the loss of this Luftwaffe long-range recce aircraft?

[udf_00]

25 Sept. 1944 :
Some Hs 129 tasked to dive-bomb the village of Tureni 8 km from Turda and their escort of three romanian fighters were intercepted by four german Bf 109, a romanian aircraft (type not specified) was holed, it exploded after the pilot has landed and vacated it.
from the french
AIRMAG N°01 : LES BF-109 ROUMAINS - Page 61

[Csaba B. Stenge]

Originally Posted by udf_00

25 Sept. 1944 :
Some Hs 129 tasked to dive-bomb the village of Tureni 8 km from Turda and their escort of three romanian fighters were intercepted by four german Bf 109, a romanian aircraft (type not specified) was holed, it exploded after the pilot has landed and vacated it.
from the french
AIRMAG N°01 : LES BF-109 ROUMAINS - Page 61

That particular emergency landed aircraft was a Hs 129, not a Bf 109, claimed by II./JG 52.

[Csaba B. Stenge]

Originally Posted by Dénes Bernád

On 25 Sept. 1944, only one ARR Bf 109G-6 was lost, to the rear gunner of a Ju 188 near Kolozsvar/Cluj/Klausenburg, Transylvania.

By the way, can anyone confirm the loss of this Luftwaffe long-range recce aircraft?

I know, that cpt. Lucian Toma was lost on that day. Rumanian sources says he was shot down by the gunners of a Ju 188, attacked succesfully by him, but it is only the Rumanian version, the story has always two sides.

Incidentally I just pointed out, that it was a claim rather against a Rumanian, than a Bulgarian aircraft. (and of course it is just a claim, which not always match with a real loss in the other side - need to check the remained sources from both sides carefully).
Kolozsvár and Szamosfalva areas are in PlQ. 37... grids but since it was a dogfight in quite high altitude, maybe the claim was not exactly in the same area, where the aircraft of Toma actually crashed.