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Pre-WW2 Military and Naval Aviation Please use this forum to discuss Military and Naval Aviation before the Second World War.

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  #31  
Old 23rd January 2020, 12:18
Petrusja Petrusja is offline
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Re: German Navy Fokker D.VII

A Dutch book by Frits Gerdessen (whom Stig already mentioned) and Nico Geldhof says the pilot of the 15 October aircraft was Unteroffizier Alfred Baum of the 1st Seeflug Abteilung, then assigned to Marine Feld Jasta IV at Coolkerke, Brugge (Bruges). A Dutch newspaper also said it came from Bruges.


Gerdessen is pretty thorough. I mailed him personally but he hasn't answered.


Quote:
at least one source "sounded" like the interned pilot (crews) were sent packing home very quickly, while the Dutch very cleverly kept the aeroplanes....
I'm not sure but that doesn't sound familiar to me, and it would compromise the Dutch neutrality to let them go, I think.

Last edited by Petrusja; 23rd January 2020 at 21:22.
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  #32  
Old 23rd January 2020, 21:36
Petrusja Petrusja is offline
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Re: German Navy Fokker D.VII

Something on Engelfried is here:

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/germany/engelfried.php


Not neccesarily reliable, of course, but note that its says he shot down a DH-9 near Walcheren, which is the Dutch peninsula around Flushing. It should be possible to find out more about that.
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  #33  
Old 24th January 2020, 01:26
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
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Re: German Navy Fokker D.VII

Doh

Terrible mistakes all over....

The book "The Jasta Pilots" have a separate chapter with regard to the Marine Jasta Pilots. So looking in the right place, both Baum and Engelfried are mentioned.

Since Engelfried obviously was an ace, he is mentioned in the "ace" book "Over the lines" as making a force landing in Holland 15 Oct 1918 and since he scored again on the 26th he was obviously not interned by the Dutch.

The book is much more silent regarding Baum since he is only listed as being in the same unit as Engelfried, and interned in Holland 15 Oct 1918. Nothing else.

Since I still believe we only had one force landing in Holland 15 Oct I am still thinking these two persons have to be one and the same.

I just can't buy that the Dutch covered up one landing, because the only solution to such a problem would be that Engelfried landed in his Fokker 5584 and was allowed to take off and return while Baum in 5288 was interned and his Fokker kept. This then immediately clash with the official Dutch listing that it was D.5584 that became their F227.
To make sure things then fit, we have to ensure that Engelfried instead was in 5288 and Baum in 5584.

Things are much easier if Baum and Engelfried are one and the same guy...

Cheers
Stig
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