General question re. Flugbuch

[bill norman]

Is there any particular reason why the third column in a Flugbuch (c.1940) is headed 'Fluggast' (Flight guest?) instead of the usual 'Begleiter' (Accompanying crew member?).

Bill Norman

[Nick Beale]

I think a Fluggast is a passenger, i.e. anyone not a member of the crew.

[Horst Weber]

Originally Posted by Nick Beale

I think a Fluggast is a passenger, i.e. anyone not a member of the crew.

Agreement.

The crew operates the a/c and anyone else in the a/c is a "Fluggast" or passenger. Even if it is a person from the same unit.

This could be else at airborne operations, since I roughly can't believe, that the para's on board of the dropping a/c's were "Fluggast".

All thest !

Horst Weber

[Norbert Schuchbauer]

There are different styles of Flugbücher. The military version has Begleiter and then there is the DVL-G version which has Fluggast. It therefor depends on which one the particular pilot was using. They also are in different sizes.

Regards,
Norbert

[bill norman]

Nick, Horst, Norbert,
Your comments correspond with my own initial interpretation. However, in the Flugbuch shown to me by a recent contact, the 'Fluggast' flew at least 42 war operations with the same unit - the majority of those being bombing operations. So , it seems, he was not a 'flight guest' in the normal sense of the word. My contact has a number of wartime photographs of the 'flight guest' taken during the period c.1941-1943. None of them show him wearing any sort of flying badge, though other documentation list him sometimes as Bordschütze and at other times as Bordmechaniker.

Norbert, what was the DVL-G version of the FB? Did it have a particular use for specific types of individual?

I wonder, were there particular Luftwaffe flying units that carried non-air qualified 'experts' of one kind or another for specific tasks related to the unit's function? If so, could you cite an example of such a unit? Or indeed, offer any explanation in respect of this apparent anomaly? Hope you can help.

Bill Norman
(website: www.billnorman.co.uk)

[canonne]

Please, excuse but ... Who wrote/filed the flugbuch ... the airman himself after his flight ? Did he write information on a draft then of this original flugbuch ?
When an airman was shot shot down/did not return from a flight: who completed his flugbuch ? with his lat mission (s) etc ... One of his comrades or someone of the administrative seciton ?
Thank you
Phil.
(sorry, it is not the exact question but your discussion about Flugbuchen and infos is very interesting).

[ju55dk]

It is as Norbert allready pointed out, a question of what type of FB was used. They came in many different sizes and forms. I have 3 different types in my Collection. Also one with the Fluggast column. The FB was aquired by the pilot/crew themselves. They had to use a version what was obtainable locally.

Junker

[Tim O.]

Originally Posted by canonne

Please, excuse but ... Who wrote/filed the flugbuch ... the airman himself after his flight ? Did he write information on a draft then of this original flugbuch ?
When an airman was shot shot down/did not return from a flight: who completed his flugbuch ? with his lat mission (s) etc ... One of his comrades or someone of the administrative seciton ?
Thank you
Phil.
(sorry, it is not the exact question but your discussion about Flugbuchen and infos is very interesting).

Hi Phil

I have a few Flugbucher and in at least two cases it seems the airmen wrote out the details of their flights into a soft-backed book and then copied the information into a larger hard-backed book, so the information is duplicated. I always assumed the soft-backed copy was more portable and might go on the aircraft, while the hard-backed copy stayed at home but this is pure conjecture.

An interesting thread!

[ju55dk]

Normally you did not carry the FB in an aircraft. It was not allowed. Enemy intelligence would get a lot of information out of a FB.

And the use of soft bound/hard cover was a matter of the individual. The soft bound was cheaper and easier to obtain.

Junker

[bill norman]

Phil, Junker, Tim,
Thanks for getting involved. The Flugbuch that was shown to me is identical to a normal copy of a Luftwaffe FB, except that the 3rd column is headed 'Fluggast' instead of the usual 'Begleiter'. All entries in the 'Fluggast' version have been written by the same person: the handwriting is identical in every case. BUT the compiler of that book does not appear to have been a member of the crew ; he seems to have been an 'extra'.

I assume that if a military FB is printed with the 3rd column showing 'Fluggast' instead of 'Begleiter', it was intended for 'guests' who were expected to make many flights - there would be no point in printing a multi-page FB for a person who is expected to make just one such flight as a 'guest'.

Junker, do you mean that in some war sectors the usual style of FB was in short supply and so crews had to take one of several versions that might have been available? If so, does your own example of the 'Fluggast' FB show many wartime flights undertaken by the same person? If so, was he actually a crew man with a flying badge?

Tim, I can't really see the point of a wartime flier taking his 'own' copy of his FB with him on war flights. What would be the value in that - apart from providing the enemy with potentially valuable intelligence in the case of his being shot down?

Bill

Bill